rush to comments!!

hahah syako!

eh, the NYT never fact checked before... why start now?

Of course it's problematic. This is how many of the ridiculous rumors about him (and others) get started and spread: some fool manages to get a bit of scandalous untruth published, and others believe it without bothering to check whether it's actually true or not.

In any case, this is Bill Kristol we're talking about here. He's not documenting an Obama backlash. He's attempting to start one, with nothing but a bunch of long words full of vague generalizations.

I could be wrong, but aren't the people who would be considered in Generation Obama already part of Generation Why?

Additionally, is there a box you can check to opt out?

Thanks!

Okay. They are continually trying to paint Obama as Anti-American, read Anti-White American, so that Whites who support him or would support him feel skittish about doing so.

Obama is not simply a Black man. He was born of White mother and raised by his White grandparents. Taught all religions, including the religion of his father Islam and grew up to choose Christianity as his faith.

Yeah Lula, but the fact that he won't fit comfortably in a box that can be disgarded makes Obama that much scarier to some people.

Is this over yet? Sigh. I'll be happy if I never hear Reverend Wrights name again.

I thought I heard a few min ago that Obama has said that Wright was "misunderstood"... I hope thats not true, get Jillness in here!

Yeah,is this over yet? Shoot give me some pumps, a dress, a fat suit and a wig I'll sing.

Yes, he said “I think the caricature that is being painted of him is not accurate,”

Eeehhh.... I dunno, I think he should distance himself and leave it at that.

And hypnotic, I would pay MONEY to see that... have you got a webcam?

cabaker--Obama is planning a speech in Pennsylvania at which he will addrses, among other things, the Wright controversy in greater detail and depth than before. I do believe he has stated that he feels the caricature of Wright in the media is a misrepresentation.

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/03/17/report-places-obama-at-controver...

Obama was in Miami during said speech. I'm not even an Obama supporter, but I think that this kind of media targeting is nonsense.

Seriously though, I don't think such a damaging and divisive story should be presented as news unless one has some assurances of proof.

Sorry cabaker27 the show was 14 years ago and the club is now out of business.

It *should* be a problem.
I've seen some of the video footage of Jeremiah Wright. The excepts were inflammatory, divisive, and racist. Also, they cast African-American's as victims--I don't believe it's ever helpful to tell anyone they are helpless victims, it's extremely pessimistic and disempowering.

So, Wright says his congregation are all victims of rich white society. Michelle Obama has never been proud of her country despite the opportunities she has had. But Barack is an apostle of hope and change? Illogical and inconsistent. There are some pieces of this puzzle missing.

By the way, I didn't get my membership card for that rich white club. Where can I sign up? Michelle Obama earned more this year than I did in the last three.

BUMMER! oh well...

I understand Obama adressing it, but unfortch. I don't think the story will go away until Nov 5th. And you KNOW this is going to be a part of that attack that will attack his patriotism... it's coming, just a matter of time...get the swift boat veterans on the phone! haha!

I just think campaign strategy wise, its probably best to denounce the sentiments and move on, by saing “I think the caricature that is being painted of him is not accurate,” it sounds like he is defending him.... not that I'm saying that guy shouldn't be defended, I'm sure he's probably done more good for his community than bad, I'm just saying campaign strategy wise I don't know if defending him is a good idea.

Lain - You have to come to the next Vast Right Wing Conspirators meeting... 2nd Thursday of every month, I'll send you the eVite.

I should be conscientious enough to include some citation on that income reference. Here's one from a quick search, at least it's a local (Chicago) source. I'll try to tweak it so it doesn't come up as a link (and thus delay the comment posting).

Check for: blogs.suntimes.com/sweet/2007/04/sweet_blog_extra_barack_and_mi.html

Obama has had so much bad press lately, it's ridiculous. I call conspiracy. I, too, wish this whole Rev. Wright thing would just die because even though Obama has denounced, completely rejected, the pastor's statements...it's just not good enough. What's astonishing is that McCain looks impeccable in relation to all this negativity. The Republicans get what they want, yet again. Only thing is that they're just stayed in the woodwork and let the Democratic Party implode. Good job, guys.

It happened, its baggage and it's an issue. People need to just accept that it’s going to be dragged out for as long as possible, whether that be right or wrong.

And Ben backing Obama makes me want to gag.. He was overplayed in '04

Kristol didn't check this assertion as he should have. It's already been disproved and he's been forced to issue a correction. The date the blogger has Obama attending the service, he was actually campaigning in Miami.

"What's astonishing is that McCain looks impeccable in relation to all this negativity." - The reason it didn't quite "stick" to McCain is because it wasn't McCain's pastor or, more importantly, a "mentor" of his.

"The Republicans get what they want, yet again." - Ah, yes, the CONSERVATIVE BASED MEDIA strikes again!

"Kristol didn't check this assertion as he should have. It's already been disproved and he's been forced to issue a correction. The date the blogger has Obama attending the service, he was actually campaigning in Miami." - It really amazes me that anyone pays any attention to the New York Times anymore. What isn't quite as amazing is the number of people they seem to have to cut every few months.

Apparently, this is the day for me to agree with people with whom I normally don't agree at all MMM--I absolutely agree with your statement about the NYT. Their standards of political reporting have gotten ridiculously low.

Hi Jude, I'm not sure exactly where we're tanding, but it does seem to be together.

"McCain looks impeccable in relation to all this negativity. The Republicans get what they want, yet again. Only thing is that they're just stayed in the woodwork and let the Democratic Party implode."

Exactly!

Look, I'm a huge Obama partisan, as is probably very obvious but it's getting really discouraging to me to see how the Democratic Party is tearing itself to shreds over the nominations. I just hope we can come together in time for the general election. Otherwise, McCain and the rest of the neocons will barely have to lift a finger to secure victory.

Here is a great article on Huff Post written by Frank Shaeffer. The media is manufacturing outrage over Wright's statements. Where is the outrage when it comes to conservative preachers.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/frank-schaeffer/obamas-minister-committe_b...

Hagee's past comments haven't mattered when it comes to McCain's campaign. Maybe it's because he hasn't attacked the US in his speeches. Anyone who is unpatriotic in the slightest sense should be burned at the stake, apparently. Doesn't help Rev. Wright's case that he's African American either. The media has far too many liberties, if you ask me.

"Anyone who is unpatriotic in the slightest sense should be burned at the stake, apparently." - No, but when the person has close ties (i.e. a mentor) to someone who is running for the President of the United States it seems to make a mark.

"Doesn't help Rev. Wright's case that he's African American either." - Yes, because we are all aware of how racist the liberal media is.

"The media has far too many liberties, if you ask me." - Damn Constitution and freedom of speech!

The New York Times is not reporting news anymore; they are branching out and now are inventing them themselves. That's what you get from having to much time and too little news.

And I didn't hear much from the conservative side when we elected a born again Evangelical President. They say a lot of weird stuff too. Or what about Romney being a Mormon? Maybe he knows someone crazy too? Perhaps his father's uncle had three heads and four wives? Run for the hills everyone, Obama's retired Reverend is a loon!

Oh, there's bombing in Iraq? Who cares.

is this over yet? not just the controversy, but this whole campaign? cannot wait until the elections. and btw, please don't lump into generation obama, because, i agree with kristol. i'm offended that just b/c you're young, you're expected to vote obama. i can think for myself and make my own decisions.

I was well aware of the responses I might have gotten because of my post, and I welcome whatever you want to say about it.

To all those who insist that racism hardly exists anymore, especially in the media are dead-wrong. Many people see only what's on the outside and there are those who are voting in this election purely on race and gender. It's so secret that because of Obama's skin color, some refuse to vote him into office. It's disappointing that election has come down to what race you are, what gender, what religion your family has been linked to, what church you attend and the people you know and their opinions. What about the issues and the solutions the candidates have in relation to them? What about the war and the soldiers who are dying in vain? No, it's all about Barack Obama's pastor and his outrageous comments! Oh my!

When the entire world doesn't revolve around the US, it's just means to drudge up anything to stay in the spotlight while destroying the character is a good person with a promising career in the process. Do you know how many people around the world actually would believe Rev. Wright's comments, at least to some extent? You'd be surprised and trust me, these people don't just live in the Middle East.

Here is a sermon by Rev. Wright the media will not show:

The Audacity to Hope

Part 1
http://youtube.com/watch?v=xFZROa0rlMU

Part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9_LQKlLSBo&feature=user

liliblu, here's the core difference between Wright and Schaeffer's remarks: Wright is characterizing and condemning people based on race, and Schaeffer is (attempting to) characterize his father as judgmental based on his moral standards.

Also, the article references activities in the '70s and '80s. Wright's remarks are current.

Most of the racism I see today comes from people of color, not "white" people. Much of the violence in L.A. is between black and brown. I don't know of any preachers who condemn minorities for their ethnicity. There are always a few exceptions, but there are also people who won't vote for Hillary because she's a woman.

Any candidate's church and friends / associates are relevant, because they show how a person really thinks, not just what they publicly profess to believe.

Oh, and the Republican's don't have to launch any spear campaigns, the Democrats are doing it themselves. Is "self-vivisecting" an applicable concept?

I'm almost at that point where I say "screw it"

They managed to turn Kerry into a deserter, Obama is probably going to be turned into a terrorist....as if accusations of him being Muslim didn't already imply that.

Whatever, its not about policies, order, and judgment, its all about news ratings and headlines, its like a battle to the death, politics in the US is opponents put through hell and whoever manages to come out alive gets the job. While I am proud to be an American, I can't say I am proud of our politics and approach to voting. What's worse than the media selling headlines is us buying them for a lot more than they're worth.

We all make this huge distinction between having a man as your pastor (whose statements you reject) and having a pastor whose statements you don't reject.

I'm not an African-American, but I can't help but think that if McCain and Obama's situations were reversed (meaning McCain's Pastor made racist remarks about AA and an Obama supporter made racist comments about whites) a lot of folks would be talking about how McCain went out of his way to reject the racist/divisive comments of his own pastor while Obama just accepted/welcomed the support of an influential figure. Double standards exist, but let me guess, its racist to say that, right?

Urghhhhhhhhhhh*&%*%^$^%#^%%#%#%-

"To all those who insist that racism hardly exists anymore, especially in the media are dead-wrong." - It's funny how much people have pressed that you shouldn't vote for a candidate because he is black or because she is a woman, but now that it is coming down to their wire it seems the race and gender card are being pulled out as possible reasons for demise.

Does racism exist today? Yes, but it is not to this far out extent that is being proposed, let alone to say that the main parts of the media, which tend to be liberally biased, are now racist against Obama because he is black. CNN, FOX, MSNBC, and the NY TIMES times are all conspiraring against Obama because he is black?

"Many people see only what's on the outside and there are those who are voting in this election purely on race and gender. " - Just as there are some who may not vote for Obama because he is black or Hillary because she is a woman, there are those voting for him because he is black and her because she is a woman. This may hold true for some, but it does not hold true for all.

"It's disappointing that election has come down to what race you are, what gender, what religion your family has been linked to, what church you attend and the people you know and their opinions." - While you say this election is coming down to race and gender, I feel like it is the left that has this pride/anger issue with it. It seems to be more of a tool used against the two Dem camps than it is as a reason to vote for McCain.

Additionally, Rev. Wright's comments have hit Obama so hard because Obama has said that he is like a mentor. That means he isn't just a random guy holding a church service, but someone who he looks up to and respects. That is why this has taken such a toll.

As for religion, it should not be a deciding factor, but religion does say something about a person and their beliefs. In turn, this says something about how the person may or may not act on certain decisions. Should it be a deciding factor? No, but it it will influence people.

"What about the war and the soldiers who are dying in vain?" - Not everyone believes they are dying in vain. I believe strongly in the US Military and the choices and actions of our armed forces.

"When the entire world doesn't revolve around the US, it's just means to drudge up anything to stay in the spotlight while destroying the character is a good person with a promising career in the process." - I don't know what this means.

"Do you know how many people around the world actually would believe Rev. Wright's comments, at least to some extent? You'd be surprised and trust me, these people don't just live in the Middle East." - There are a lot of radically left wing people I know and who I have met that carries these ideas and yes, they live right here in the US. It amazes me. Maybe it'll help Obama get those?

"I don't know of any preachers who condemn minorities for their ethnicity."

I do not understand what you're implying with this statement. Please explain, if you care to.

"There are always a few exceptions, but there are also people who won't vote for Hillary because she's a woman."

True.

"Much of the violence in L.A. is between black and brown. "

Another true statement and I BELIEVE this is why most Hispanic voters are far more pro-Hillary. Please note that I never said that 'whites don't want a black man in Office'...I'd rather not take the discussion in that direction. Although, there are people who discount the fact that Obama is actually half-white in heritage just because he doesn't LOOK it(in my opinion, he does look it but that's probably because I'm able to discern mixed race people easier being a person of mixed race myself) and the notion that if you have one drop of black blood in your DNA, then you're black.

Did Rev. Wright state that he hated Whites? When I listened to Wright's comments I heard a man critizing the government/nation for its actions not an entire race.

"It's funny how much people have pressed that you shouldn't vote for a candidate because he is black or because she is a woman, but now that it is coming down to their wire it seems the race and gender card are being pulled out as possible reasons for demise."

I see where you're going with this, but I have to add my two cents that the two concepts are not mutually exclusive. I and many other supporters of both candidates aren't voting for them because of race or gender, which is a good thing IMO--but that doesn't mean that they aren't in danger from those who would disqualify them based on race or gender. You even said that later on--and that absolutely does mean that race is, of course, an issue.

Did I type in invisible ink?

It's funny how the NYT were so wrong about McCain, but somehow so spot on about Obama. I love all of you conservatives here, but isn't this double standard? I gave McCain the benefit of the doubt, but you guys all hop on the "I hate left wing" train. Yes he was a "spiritual mentor", not a political one. Unlike Bush Obama actually doesn't take political advice from Jesus.

tresjolie!

"You even said that later on--and that absolutely does mean that race is, of course, an issue." - Yes, but only to some. When it comes to Politics and the Public Image, everything (and I mean everything to to the point of whether or not Candidate X enjoys Corn over Carrots) seems to come out and can affect the way an individual votes, but that does not mean it is the major reason why a person does or does not vote for someone. I don't see race/gender really being a front-line issue as for why most people are voting for someone as it is now trying to be made to seem if it is and has been all along.

""When the entire world doesn't revolve around the US, it's just means to drudge up anything to stay in the spotlight while destroying the character is a good person with a promising career in the process." - I don't know what this means."

What I meant is the America is very ethnocentric, as many countries and people are, but that their ethnocentrism is on a whole 'nother level. The American government system is a bully, very much so. You don't have to agree with me on that. The way I see it, Obama is very much willing to listen and work with the people to achieve betterment in this country. Some see that as a pipe dream, some see it as a necessity(i.e. myself). Look at, for instance, when Fidel Castro resigned and there was suggestion of the US having a meeting with Cuba. Hillary said that if she were President, she wouldn't agree to a meeting unless certain changes were made in Cuba. Obama said he would be willing to meet without stipulations. Do you now see the point I am trying to make? I believe that Obama has taken the brunt of attacks because of who he is and what he stands for, not so much his race although I think it's an minor underlying factor.

"that does not mean it is the major reason why a person does or does not vote for someone."

You'd be surprised...or not There are plenty of voters who aren't particularly informed, don't have the time or wherewithal to become more informed, or whatever, and base their preferences on just such irrelevant personal characteristics such as race, gender, underwear style, vegetable preference, and other such Public Image issues But that's not the fault of the candidates--any of them.

"Unlike Bush Obama actually doesn't take political advice from Jesus."

Oh snap!

You're so right, Jude. *thumbs up!*

Honestly, Tres, when this issue with Wright First arose many of the people who were condemning McCain's ties were all sticking up for Obama. This hypocrisy was raised before.

The flip-side of the issue, as I have stated numerous times, is that there is a difference between a random person who endorses an individual and when the person in question is not only the pastor of the individual's church, but also is a mentor to the person.

Your political comments shouldn't hurt me if I were to run for office and you were to endorse me as we have no affiliation to each other, but if I told you that Ronald McDonald was a close friend and mentor, his actions would be a reflection on me as I said he is a close friend and mentor.

We are not comparing apples to apples here.

Indie--I totally agree with you on American ethnocentrism and nationalism!

I find it painful to hear Obama's willingness to meet with foreign leaders, listen to them and work with them, rather than bullying them as you say, characterized as weakness--I read, somewhere on one of these blogs, someone saying that "Obama is going to disarm us and meet with terrorists" or something like that. That is, unfortunately, quite a common mentality here, and it's something I believe he is uniquely suited to address, both domestically and in building better relations with other countries.

MMM- We might disagree on this one. If Romney is a Mormon or McCain isn't religious, it just doesn't matter to me. It might be because i"m not religious myself, but but unless the Reverend is working for the campaign, giving political advice or running as a VP slot, then I don't think it matters. Honestly; Bush has surrounded himself with far more extreme SPIRITUAL mentor and guides, but somehow we should leave the Republican alone, but the Democrat is fair game. Unlike Bush I highly doubt Obama will go and discuss Iraq strategies with his congregation like Bush did with the Evangelicals. So for someone who is for separating church and state; I also separate spiritual mentor and political mentor.