I'll start small... one-half of $634 billion ain't $175 billion. Obama can't do math. Discuss.

Holy living mother of God.

But his figures don't add up. Medicare annual budget is around 400 billion. His cuts to medicare will be around 600 mill. I just don't see how it will add up unless he taxes people that earn 250,000 at 50%. The Iraq war has cost 500 billion, and people b*tch and moan about that, yet they don't care that this president has spent over a trillion in the 5 weeks in office. Nuts, people are nuts I tell you

"Do you support spending $634 billion to advance these priorities?" um...no. Of course, it seems like they're asking the same question in 20 different ways. Still, my answer remains the same.

kranky that 175 billion figure is only for part of the planned adjustments to medicare: "Drug makers would have to increase medication rebates to Medicaid patients. Also, hospitals with high readmission rates would receive less Medicare funds."

"Holy living mother of God. "

Yup. Seriously, I try really hard to not get emotional on this forumn, but I can't help it this time.

I honestly believe the man is an ideologue... or he's just straight up insane. Only an ideologue or insane person would look at the reality of our current economic conditions, the fact that Medicare funding is running out, and the amount of money we just spent on porkulus and STILL think this plan is a good idea.

I get it... Obama et al want universal healthcare. What is frightening is that he apparently doesn't care that we can't afford it.

moonlight-

Yeah, I got that. There are no definites in this plan, only assumptions. And $162.5 billion is a big gap. Especially considering that Medicare funding is about to run out. How can he start new programs when we can't afford the ones we have?

I have to add that what you pointed out also means that all non-Medicaid patients' drugs and hospitals stays will increase in price. Joy.

my mother is a cleveland clinic (one of the most prestigious hospital systems in the world for the ignorant) nurse, and we still had to file for medical bankruptcy because I got sick ($30000 in debt w/ the 20% copays). Does that not strike people as insane? You can get knocked down from middle to lower class by a medical issue...you could lose your home and not because you were irresponsible. We need to address the healthcare issue NOW. it is important both ethically and economically.

Fact: single-payer systems are far cheaper than private insurance for bureacracy-haters, private insurance companies make the government bureacracy look nearly non-existent. Insurance companies waste time and money trying to avoid paying out funds. It is madness.

I said other - I'm going to wait until there are a lot more details before I make a decision on if I like this or not. Maybe we will get more after this summit is over.

Where is this money coming from????

kranky - I was a non-medicaid patient and as I said, went bankrupt (they punished my mom for working fulltime 6 days a week. at 5 we would have qualified). the system is broken as it is.

I agree with moonlight, something has to be done now. The current system doesn't work and is going broke, we don't have to to wait and figure out a solution down the road. Same goes with social security.

and I'm really sorry about your situation moonlight, this happens so much in this country its a disgrace. My sister is a lawyer and does a lot of insurance work, and its unbelievable how greedy, sneaky, and stoic the private insurance companies can be so they don't have to pay out. The stories she tells me make me sick.

Also, hospitals with high readmission rates would receive less Medicare funds."
this sounds so much like the spectacle that is "no child left behind" You are putting a band aid on a splinter when the whole arm is about to fall of!!

moonlight and diadem-

I never said that things were hunkey-dorey in the world of health care coverage. Obviously, they aren't.

However, that is not an excuse to try and put out a fire with no water... we haven't any more water in this situation. It is irresponsible for our leaders to act like we do.

Why do you not have an out of pocket maximum. I am not sure what insurance you have, but most insurances have out of pocket maximums WAYYYYYY less than 30,000

What system is going broke?

Good point Hainan... is Obama going to limit the amount of time that people can spend in hospitals? If the goal is to lower readmission rate, then it seems like the hospitals will now have incentive to "overtreat" patients.

The Iraq war has cost 500 billion, and people b*tch and moan about that, yet they don't care that this president has spent over a trillion in the 5 weeks in office. Nuts, people are nuts I tell you

Yes I do bitch and moan about that because I thought we should have never been in Iraq and it was handled poorly once we were there and has essentially been a sh$% show for the past three years. I would have much rather put that money towrds things to help this country.

Healthcare is in a really bad state in this country. It gets more and more expensive every year, offers less and less every year and we are the least healthy nation yet we spend the most on healthcare. Something is obviously not working. I agree with the part of his plan that puts the focus on prevention and wellness. Many other countries reward doctors and hospitals that promote and achieve healthy lifestyles for their patients, i.e quitting smoking, losing weight, well visits for children etc. The less people need to use health services, especially for emergencies, the less the cost of healthcare would be. We are the opposite in this country. A lot of insurance companies have higher premium rates for women. Their reasoning, we go to the doctor more (we tend to get physicals and we have our annual gyno appointments, and mammograms). But they will tell you thats what they want you to do, get the preventitive care so that you won't need the more costly emergency and/or long term care. Its very hypocritical.

I meant six years not three, oops.

I don't know where you have received your info from Roar, but my husbands insurance premiums are higher than mine.

The only people who think the system is broken are the uninsured. i happen to love our medical system.
But someone said the system is going "broke" ? really what does this mean?

"we are the least healthy nation yet we spend the most on healthcare."

This is not due to our healthcare system... as you pointed out, it is due to our lifestyle choices.

I guess we now get into the personal responsibility debate, but I do not think that it is solely the healthcare industry's responsibility to keep us in shape.

moonlight-

I do have to ask one question - how old were you when you got sick? It is entirely possible that you would have been covered under the SCHIPS plan.

yes kranky, what happened to personal responsibility.
And to fix a lot of the problems you stated Roar, it should be done on a smaller level. Government dictating how businesses should operate based on the bottom line is a huge gray area. With such programs as "no child left behind"" we should be more aware that setting standards doesn't translate well all the way down the line.

I received my information from the insurance company my plan is with through my employer. I am not uninsured and I think our system doesn't work.

"This is not due to our healthcare system... as you pointed out, it is due to our lifestyle choices. " It is both. We don't promote wellness or a healthy lifestyle. We throw pills at the problem and treat things once they get bad reather than focusing on prevention.

Hainan :"The only people who think the system is broken are the uninsured. " WTF? did I not just say that I am insured and think it is broken?

Thank you mydiadem and bless your friend. I have great appreciation for the people fighting.

I also love the people that are critical of our healthcare system smoke and drink alcohol.

kranky: I was 16-17.

also kranky while you are right to a degree that personal responsibility is important - a lot of people make really unhealthy choices - that still doesn't mean we should spend the most on healthcare.

Personally I think we need to stop wasting time and money and just go to a more streamlined single-payer system.

Nay. More government involvement in healthcare is poison!

I work in healthcare. I deal with insurances on a day to day basis. The major problem with our medical system is the people, not the insurances.
Hospitals in California have to raise their prices to cover many reasons. The lowest paying insurance is government insurances. But hospitals cannot receive any funding for their emergency rooms unless they accept to see these patients. The government programs are a HUGE reason for escalating costs. They pay so little that they have to charge insurances and private pay patients more.
Our hospital helps people with their bills. If you owed $30,000 at our hospital, we would offer steep discounts and there are also a multitude of local charity programs that are available. I guess the problem was not in your insurance but rather the facility that you received your care at. A good hospital would rather work with you and give you reasonable payment plan and decrease that amount owed and write off the rest, rather than get nothing. your story just doesn't add up/

roar-

I maintain that it is the responsibility of each individual to live a healthy lifestyle.

I do honestly believe that the practices you are referring to are very quickly phasing out. Every time I go to the doctor, I am grilled on my smoking, eating, drinking, and exercising habits.

At any rate, I fail to see how throwing money (that we don't have) at universal healthcare is going to force individauls to make healthy lifestyle choices. Obama is making these two issues one, and they are not. Universal healthcare and preventative healthcare are two seperate ideas, and can be accomplished independent of one another.

No we don't have a perfect system, but I'll be damned if we need to end up with a system like Canada's. I have seen numerous people come all the way to the central valley in California to receive their medical care rather than wait for care in Canada.

Also, the states get a lot of the qualified medical personel from Canada. Who want's to go to school for 8+ years to earn so little. yay for socialism.

moonlight,

I am truly sorry that you were so ill at such a young age.

But, it should make you feel better that if that had happened today, it would not have impacted your family to the extent it did. SCHIPs would have covered your costs, so the plan Obama is pushing would have had nothing to do with your particular scenario.

Hainan your hospital is not indicative of the country, it would be nice if it was. Also, my health issue required stay at more than one hospital b/c I required a specialist - all of which had to be improved by my insurance. Many insurance plans do not let you go wherever you want. I know people who have had larger debts than I - talking upwards of $100,000. I am perfectly serious and speaking from EXPERIENCE. this actually happened to me.

Why though is the healthcare system so bad in America??? Can someone please tell me cos i really want to know. My dad spent the past 3 years dealing with my grandparents' health issues and the last two months involved two amputations in two weeks and treatment form the country's top specialist in that area but my parents landed on their feet. If it had been America they would have been bankrupt in the first month by the looks of things.

Knowing how the government runs other programs, the idea of the government providing healthcare scares me!

kranky - indeed I wish I had access to that. It would have made my mother's life so much easier, not to mention mine.

Actually, most hospitals have adopted the payment programs i mentioned a long time ago. But if you don't call the hospital and explain your situation, you would never know.

@skb that fear is certainly fair haha but the fact is that insurance companies make their profit from finding ways not to pay. and it isn't like the government would be actually treating us, just making it affordable

My dad is uninsured, spent 15 days in 2 hospitals last year, saw many specialist, and is not bankrupt. Seriously, personal responsibility please.

And I have seen the reverse of that Hainan. People who have gone to Canada to get the care that they needed. I know a couple of people from here who now live in Canada who are happy with the healthcare system there. One family had a child with leukemia and she got wonderful treatment and is now cancer free. There was no waiting six months for chemo and three months for tests like some people would like you to believe. No 4 hour waits in the emergency room (which even if there was, I don't see what the big deal is, since we have priviate insurance here and we all wait a long time in the emergency room). Anyhoo, I think there are many misconceptions of the troubles faced by countries with single payer healthcare.

Medicare/medi-caid patients receive the worst care. I really hope if you all get this implemented that you don't severely regret it. Really, really bad idea.

Hainan 15 days? TRY 3 MONTHS. 6 Weeks I was LEGALLY REQUIRED TO BE THERE. My mother worked 6 days a week. How dare you "personal responsibility" me.

Oh, roar, I speak only from personal experience. At our hospital we have 8 Canadian doctors. And I have personally help well over a dozen patients from canada

I didn't personal responsibility you moonlight. You were a child. You had no responsibility other than getting healthy.

@hainan ok. thank you.

It the after effect... I know many people who have had problems paying medical bills. if you ignore the calls, you will never know what they have to offer. Also going out into your community and seeking help. one single experience does not make or break a program. People are misinformed about healthcare in the united states. really people, the government programs are the biggest problem facing hospitals today.