Can medical personnel refuse to care for convicted serial killers or child molesters? Drunk drivers or drug addicts who have injured themselves and others it was their own weakness...)? I would hate to be a hospital administrator right now.
34 more days of this crap...

I thought the point of being a medical professional was accepting the responsibility to do whatever one can to help one's patients, regardless of one's own personal beliefs about the patients or the procedures.

Ew Jude, how gross would it be to touch someone you disapproved of?

This should apply to everyone, in any profession. We should all be allowed to opt out of anything that we find morally objectionable without repercussion.

Right, Steph?

I know abortion is always the reason this issue comes up, but here's the flip side: what if the only doctor a pregnant woman can find to provide prenatal care refuses to give her prenatal care on the grounds that the doctor thinks she will be an unfit mother and should get an abortion instead?

I would think the prenatal care refuser would have a very strong case, because those doctors are at greater professional risk with their long-term involvement with the questionable patient.
So if the hospital's doctors refuse to treat the woman because of their various beliefs, what is the responsibility of the hospital to the woman? Will the government pay to relocate her near a facility where someone will treat her?

so does this pertain to the morning after pill too? why don't people comprehend that this contraception is NOT abortion. also, it is time sensitive. People - such as, say, rape victims - should not have to run from doctor to doctor to get the morning after pill.

THIS IS STUPID. If you have a problem with a part of your job, don't go into that line of work.

I'm just LOVING all of these midnight rulings that Bush is sneaking in before he leaves.

How far do we bend policies or laws to accommodate religion?

In a democracy, the possibilities are limitless.

I'm confused as to who this law is meant to impact. I know it says "recipients of federal money", but in terms of what?

From my meager understanding, it seems like this law is unnecessary. Certainly doctors, nurses, etc. should be able to refuse to do any treatment they morally oppose. But in the same vein, their employers ought to be able to fire them for refusing to do part of their job.

Oh snap!

I don't understand, if you don't want to fill birth control prescriptions or give abortions, WHY CHOOSE A PROFESSION WHERE YOU DO THAT?

"Certainly doctors, nurses, etc. should be able to refuse to do any treatment they morally oppose. But in the same vein, their employers ought to be able to fire them for refusing to do part of their job."

I completely agree mich.

"Certainly doctors, nurses, etc. should be able to refuse to do any treatment they morally oppose. But in the same vein, their employers ought to be able to fire them for refusing to do part of their job."

I totally agree as well. The problem is that this law would make it illegal for the employer to fire them for refusing to do a part of their job if they morally oppose it.

Another complete abuse of the Constitution.

moonlight- for those of us who believe that life begins at conception, the morning after pill IS abortion because it prevents the fertilized egg from implanting into the lining of the uterus and the baby can't develop.

i am currently a freshman in college and trying to decide if I want to go premed or not, I know that if Obama passes FoCA and i had to perform abortions there is no chance that I would even consider becoming a doctor. and to those of you who said not to choose a profession that requires you to perform those acts, some people have always wanted to help people by becoming doctors but also feel sickened by the idea of aborting a baby

elizabeth, so what if aborting the baby could save the life of the mother? Would you let both the baby and the mother die because you object to abortion? There are many reasons for why people choose to do abortions. If you're a doctor depending on the field you have to go into, you probably will never have to do an abortion.

While, I myself an against abortion, I however do not think that it's right to enforce my own ideas on people who believe differently from me. Women have abortions for a number of reasons and that's something and they should retain the right to continue choose on whether or not that's a route they want to go.

Another bullsh*t move by Bush. Luckily this loser will be soon out of office forever.

Well said Myst.

The only problem I have with abortion is it is killing someone. Unfortunately, the only thing wrong with that child is the mother who felt indifferent enough to commit murder.

So go into brain surgery. It's not like they're going to ask a podiatrist to perform an abortion. Give me a break.

"Hello Ms. Smith! I'm going to be performing your bunion surgery today, would you like me to abort your fetus while I've got you under?"

"Dave have you even met a woman that has made the decision to actually have an abortion?"

Yes, I know two.

That book sounds almost interesting. Let me know when you get something to actually put into it...

again UnDave, another comment that makes me wonder about you. I hate the idea of abortions, but at least I know that just because a person have one, isn't because the mother felt indifferent to her child. There are women have abortion because they were raped, impregnated by a molesting relative, medical reasons, and because some women aren't mental or financially ready to be a mother. I rather have someone abort a baby before it's born, instead of dumping it in a garbage can or raising a child that they're not in the position to be able to take care of. While I don't like it, I understand the reasons for it.

Seriously blue. You have to be a certain kind of doctor to perform abortions for pete's sake.

Amen myst! Good points.

Damn it I forgot my for blue's statement.

I mean really. Just cause you want to be a doctor doesn't mean you're going to go into general practice and be "forced" to do something you're morally opposed to. Most people that go to med school have a specialty in mind.

Gee. I'm glad my vet isn't against spaying or neutering on the basis of moral grounds.

Thanks Bluesarah and harmony As for Elizabeth There are so many different professions that she could go into, neurosurgery, internal medicine, oncology,...etc. why should that deter you from becoming a doctor just because you might preform an abortion. My uncle is a doctor and have been practicing for almost 20 years and have never had to perform and probably will never perform one because it's not his field.

Hehe Fuzzles

The vet wants to newter my dog, with a passion. I wish she'd just leave him alone.

"The only problem I have with abortion is it is killing someone."
The only someone you seem to mind killing is a fetus - otherwise, you've posted defenses for killing of all kinds of people. And so have a number of other people here who claim to be advocates for the right to life. It raises serious questions about the devotion to life versus the determination to judge others.

Riiiight, cos every woman who's had an abortion is a cold-blooded killer who just woke up one day and said, "Wow, I'm in the mood to spill some fetal blood. BRING IT ON, MOTHERF*CKER!!!!!!!!!!!"

I agree with Mich, Harm, bluesarah, steph, and Myst on this one. The medical profession has a crapload of, y'know, ethical sticky situations, so...yeah, don't go into the field if you're not ready to grapple with many, many issues.

wow there is a big difference between taking care of a patient who is a murderer and actually helping perform an abortion, which in a lot of peoples opinions (and a lot of nurses and doctors opinions) is murder. especially if you were working on a floor unrelated to any kind of pregnancy or birth and you just happened to have a patient and the situation came up. i dont think you should get in trouble if you dont want to help on moral grounds.

I guess I'm a murderer. Lock me up.
When you've walked in my shoes, then feel free to judge me. Whatever.

I'm seriously over hearing guys judge abortion. When would you ever be in the situation? Oh yeah, never.

Well IMO opinion if a single celled organism can be considered life the moment it starts wiggling around than a fetus which is so much more complex in it's first trimester is considered life.

Despite my opinion I do not begrudge a women her right to choose under the law, however if I were a Dr. I would have to be held at gun point before I perform an abortion.

Hypno,

You lost me at wiggling!

wren
take it as you will...

Wren, so off the subject. That dog is cute in his outfit!

The Bush administration announced its "conscience protection" rule for the health care industry yesterday, giving everyone including doctors, hospitals, receptionists and volunteers in medical experiments the right to refuse to participate in medical care they find morally objectionable.

Now heres the clincher........................

The right-to-refuse rule includes abortion, but Leavitt's office said it extends to other aspects of health care where moral concerns could arise, including birth control, emergency contraception, in vitro fertilization, stem cell research or assisted suicide.

Now lets say a doctor who believes in assisted suicide lets it be known in some subtle way. What if old uncle fred knows this and insists on being taken to this doctor knowing that the doctor will not try very hard to keep him alive because it goes against his conscience? Pretty soon all the elderly who want to die will be going to this doctor who can defend his actions on moral grounds.

Now lets say that there is a doctor who is not crazy about the police. A wounded officer is rushed to the hospital and the doctor refuses treatment on moral grounds.

Lets say that there is a Vietnamese or Iraqi doctor on the night shift at a major hospital, and some decorated veteran who has had his picture in the paper arrive for an emergency procedure with only minutes to live. The doctor refuses treatment on moral grounds.

Lets say that anyone who has had their picture in the paper or the court report is rushed to the hospital for emergency treatment with only minutes to live. The doctor in attendance has seen their picture in the paper or read the court report and refuses treatment on moral grounds.

Lets say a doctor is not very good, bottom of the class, drunk, whatever , and the patient dies. Can the doctor claim that their behaviour was actually the result of a moral decision so as to avoid a malpractice suit?

LETS THINK ABOUT THIS.....................

I agree with UnDave here, and I stand by any doctors right to "first do no harm"

Some doctors, at the health departments are doing dual duties such as OB/GYN and General Practices and therefore are in that position to practice different specialties and if they run into someone wanting an abortion, they should be able to refuse base on their Moral principles. The patient can go somewhere else, its not hard to find someone who will. The Doctor will lose that patient but to him or her its better than losing thier soul. and we should respect that.

Caterpillar, apparently you don't live in a rural or remote area of the country, like MILLIONS of people do. How easy do you think it is for people who are living in poor, rural areas to RELOCATE or DRIVE HOURS AND HOURS (oh yeah, probably during business hours or hours when they may need to be taking care of their families) to find a doctor who'll deign themselves willing to help?

This is total crap. I guess we should all be so lucky to live in Caterpillar's dream world where there is an affordable doctor on everyone's insurance on every corner and in the field next door?

P.S. "First do no harm" INCLUDES saving the life of a mother whose pregnancy might KILL HER.

Blargh.

No judging here, wren :hugs:

...and I have always had that mentality about men being so "OMG WHAT A MURDERER!!!!" about abortion. No uterus = no idea what it would ever be like to be pregnant = not much crediblity in determining what it would be like to possibly be faced with the decision of an abortion.

Darn it.

Well said Menomena.