The House failed to pass the historic $700 billion Wall Street bailout this afternoon causing the Dow to crash a historic 780 points, and making President Bush "very disappointed." A roll call of the votes shows that 133 House Republicans voted no, while 65 voted yes. As for the Democrats, 140 voted yes, and 95 voted no. Thirty out of 38 House members in tight reelection races voted against the bailout.
After taking credit for the bill before it failed, the McCain camp had tough words for Obama this afternoon. Firing off the first statement, McCain said: "Barack Obama failed to lead, phoned it in, attacked John McCain, and refused to even say if he supported the final bill."
As for Obama, he blamed the deregulatory climate supported by John McCain. His campaign released a statement saying this is a "moment of national crisis" and criticizing "the angry and hyperpartisan statement released by the McCain campaign."
Speaker Pelosi will most likely call for a new vote, but if it doesn't pass — Wall Street might have to wait until the US has a new president. As the stock market certainly falls, the next step toward a solution is uncertain.
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Laura Biagiotti
This is a scary scary day. AND McCain trying to blame this entire thing on Obama is downright disgusting.
1My exhausted and pessimistic 2 cents is this: Who cares. Let's have another great depression and let the world markets collapse. It happened before, it's happening again, it will happen in the future. We will not learn from our mistakes. History repeats itself like a broken record. Let's just all point fingers at each other while the ship sinks.
I've always wanted to live like Little House on the Prairie so maybe this is my motivation to learn to live off the land. As long as I find a way to get high speed internet access and a daily shower I will be all set!
2
3everyone pointin fingers now.
4Considering the Dem yesses were 140 and the Repub yesses were 65, how is McCain blaming this on Obama? That just makes no sense.
I don't even know what I want to happen here. I wonder if it truly be as dire as everyone predicts.
5I'm sort of with Mariner - let's just get on with the pain so we can get through it.
6My good friend - - - - - - who works for Sen. Feinstein says that the Sen. wants to put the corp. execs on a boat and set it on fire. LOL!
7Barney Frank:"Give me those twelve people's names, and I will go talk uncharacteristically nicely to them, and tell them what wonderful people they are, and maybe they'll think about the country."
8http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/09/29/frank-because-somebody-hu_n_130...
I was listening about the 600 page plan on the radio -- I think I'm glad it failed.
9Agreed, harm.
And now we're literally pointing fingers at people who point fingers at people who point fingers. Aye-aye-aye.
10pop, McCain tried to blame this on Obama by trying equate him with the partisan stir that resulted after Pelosi's statement before the vote was complete. Here's the statement McCain made this afternoon after the bill failed:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/26945513#26947614
The part about Barack Obama is towards the end of the clip. McCain is basically making false statements about Obama and hoping that voters will be dumb enough not to know any better. Obama has actually been far more bi-partisan on this issue that McCain, at least in my humble opinion.
11ruh roh. the one day i have too much work to do to follow the news, the entire world collapses? i'm scared! hold me!!
12MarinerMandy! I've thought this mslieruhzillion times myself!
"I've always wanted to live like Little House on the Prairie so maybe this is my motivation to learn to live off the land. As long as I find a way to get high speed internet access and a daily shower I will be all set!"
13I'm grossed out that this situation is being used for presidential politics. No time for the blame game. Play nice people!
14Although I want this situaution to be addressed the first thing that floats across the table may not be the best thing. I mean this rush mentality is partly the reason we are in this type of situation now...people had been rushing to deregulated, rushing to buy a home, and now we are in this mess.
And pointing fingers is obviously pointless!
15am i the only one having an emotional response to this?? is it time to start hoarding?
16I'm kind of glad it didn't pass. Lets learn from the mistakes (past and present) and restructure, and come back stronger. Yeah, I'm an idealist.
17
hypno - I think that is the best solution I have heard yet!!
18I don't think it's time to start hoarding.
19I don't think it's quite time to start hoarding, but it is probably time to note where the stuff you'd want to hoard is most easily obtained. I think considering second job options is probably useful, though it's hard to figure out which are the best places to consider.
20i love the fact that the GOP is blaming the Dem speaker and McCain is blaming Obama -- yet -- we look at the vote:
Dem (Yea) 140
21Repub (Yea) 65 -- 130 NOs!!!!
From what I heard on the radio -- I don't like this bill.
22I'm going to move back to Wisconsin if the sh*t really hits the fan.
Right on Lake Superior. I'm going to buy myself a cow or two and some chickens and chill out for a while.
23all of this talk of moving back to the land is worrying me... i don't have any land to move back to. i grew up in the suburbs and don't even know how to pick vegetables much less grow them. i'm going to STARVE!!! wait, will annies mac & cheese still exist?
24Haha, I know my friend said Diane was pissed she came all the way back to Ca. on Saturday and they called her and said you need to come back. She was only here for about 12hrs. before she high tailed it back to D.C.
25YY, I grew six tomatoes and a bean this summer - you can come to my house and we'll share.
26I was just going to invite you to my house, yy! We have sweet potatoes growing in the yard. Not sure we're zoned for livestock.
27Oh speaking of has any one tried hydroponic gardening? It is amazing. You should google it sometime if you're really into gardening.
28Good idea, home grown pot could be what gets us through!
29The new American staple and cash crop.
30hahah, thanks for the invites. i just might take you all up on those offers. i wish i'd never read that book "the road" by cormac mccarthy. anyone else read that? that's what i keep imagining! AAAAAH!
31stephley: "Good idea, home grown pot could be what gets us through!"
ROFL!
Wahhh I'm highly allergic ): But luckily have a green thumb and was planning to expand my garden next year anyway. So at least we won't starve. (;
32The Depression was not a good time.
People who might feel secure now might feel free to say "bring it on", but really, a lot of people are at risk for their jobs right now. This has screwed up the credit industry that small and large businesses use to operate on a daily basis for things like payroll, operating expenses, etc. If businesses don't have credit, they will shut down and take their jobs and spending with them.
Businesses that have nothing to do with Wall Street or mortgages are in severe risk right now.
People's payroll is in severe risk right now.
People's jobs are at risk right now.
No bueno.
I think many politicians aren't speaking about this in specific terms because they don't want panic and massive money withdrawls from banks. The fact is, citizens don't want this bail out but they don't realize how THEY will be affected by this.
33Just to be clear, point wise this was the largest drop in history, however percentage wise it only dropped 7% which is a lot less than the 22% it dropped in 1987.
3495 dems voted no to this
of all the things to be partisan on, this shouldn't be one of them, but if the final bill included perks like funding for ACORN, then Im glad it got voted down.
35Jillness: "The Depression was not a good time. People who might feel secure now might feel free to say "bring it on", but really, a lot of people are at risk for their jobs right now. This has screwed up the credit industry that small and large businesses use to operate on a daily basis for things like payroll, operating expenses, etc. If businesses don't have credit, they will shut down and take their jobs and spending with them.
Businesses that have nothing to do with Wall Street or mortgages are in severe risk right now. People's payroll is in severe risk right now. People's jobs are at risk right now.
No bueno.
I think many politicians aren't speaking about this in specific terms because they don't want panic and massive money withdrawls from banks. The fact is, citizens don't want this bail out but they don't realize how THEY will be affected by this."
Due to 9/11 a tremendous amount of people have already lost their jobs, businesses, and homes. As a personal example my brother lost his job as an IT for a financial institution, and finally wound up becoming a full time welder after searching up and down the eastern coast for 3 years. I lost my brick and mortar store -- a small business -- as did far too many of my neighbors in NYC as a direct result of the post-9/11 economy.
Most small businesses (that I know of) can't afford to take out loans, hire excess employees, or operate on credit. Yeah we pretty much make do with what's coming in, not overextending ourselves into debt.
IMO the ones who benefit from a bailout will be the corporations who put their money into the market. The market is a gamble isn't it? You never know, you could hit big or lose big. The people with small businesses aren't in the market, and everyone I know who has "played" with the market used money we didn't expect to see again, just like being at a casino. So hypothetically if they bail out Wall St shouldn't they bail out the little guy who lost his shirt at the casino? Both knew what they were getting into from the start, right?
I do agree that people don't understand quite how difficult times can get during a depression, but I don't think a bail-out is going to help us. We're already fighting job, business and home loss, a worthless dollar, and having become the laughing stock of the world. So I can see where people feel like "lets just get this over with and move on." It *can* and was done before, and if we have savvy leadership, hopefully they will learn from the past mistakes and it won't be as terrible as the last depression.
36We have no idea what could come of this. It is not funny.
37By the way, did any of you actually read the House on the Prairie books? I am forever scarred by "The Long Winter".
haus THANK YOU for bringing that up. it didn't hit me until i got home that we were talking about POINTS... yes it's the largest fall ever, but the dow has grown so much that the percent change is much smaller than it would have been even in 1987. whew. yay to facts and reason and nay to my crazed emotional responses to these things.
WE'RE GONNA LIVE.
38What I am curious about is how many democrats voted NO to this? Don't they have the majority? Wouldn't this have passed if the Dems had voted straight party? Why did this fail, if the repubs aren't the majority?
39hmm.. after reading all 39 comments i have a few questions cause i dont fully understand this.
1. if the bailout goes through who really benifits from this the little guy or the guy on wall street who salary is based on the stock market.
2.how can this effect the banks if they are fdic insured?
3. depression?? OMG isnt there a way just to use all that money to help the people who took out these loans and mortages somehow.
just wondering casue i was reading all day and watching the news and still a little confused.
40One thing I've heard about this is the money spent is going to be roughly $3,000/American citizen. Since this money would be better spent in sending it to the American people, I'll be waiting for the $12,000 (There are four Americans in my family) check in my mailbox. I think that would be a better way to help us, and not send this money to Fannie and Freddie.
41I will take $3000 as well, thanks.
42i was watching the vote while i was at the gym today and it wasn't a good thing to see what was going on. i think that what we need to remember is that there's a reason that it didn't pass. yes the government realizes that we need to do something to bail out the banks, but they are also trying to find something that will protect the taxpayers which is where the money would come from - so it's kind of a good thing. i always have to think about how the market drops/crashes when people are anxious because they don't know as much about what's going on behind the scenes, and this is an example of it. people freaked out since the bailout didn't pass - but this could be a good thing since there's still time for another round of negotiations to see if they CAN pass it.
43I think a majority of people are really misguided by the media. The fact of the matter is all of us will be impacted if there is no "bail out". The term bail out has such a negative connotation that the whole pulbic is against it. But no one really understands how it will impact us. Everyone who says let the markets correct themselves--must have a large stack of cash lying around somewhere b/c you don't need any credit. Essentially this will impact credit. Banks will not be able to loan any money out. That means it will be harder for any of us to get a loan on a house or a car. Your credit limit on your card will shrink. i.e. I have 1500.00 on a 5k cc that additional 3500.00 will be taken away if this bail out doesn't go through b/c the bank won't lend it to you. Think how this will impact businesses? Unless we can all operate on cold hard cash on a day to day basis then yes, you can afford to say "let the markets" correct themselves. But more than likely you use your credit card a couple of times a month. Not to mention the fact that there will be a ton of jobs lost in the financial sector, MAYBE and this is a big MAYBE that the market will turn itself around but it will get a lot worse then better. Everyone thinks that we're bailing out rich CEO's but the fact of the matter is the impact is global. Yes, it really is as bad as it sounds. sorry for the long post...
44Of course mccain is going to chew out obama. the name of the game is "try to make the other person look bad." the presidential race is a competition after all.
45Vireland, I fully understand how it will impact us and I'm thrilled the bill failed.
46Can you explain why? I would just like to offer a different perspective, when you ask most people why they are against the bail out its b/c they are scared of the price tag (everyone should question it) BUT there is a reason behind it. To allow banks to issue loans for people to continue to keep their homes, to buy homes, send their kids to college, pay for heating ...etc..This is by no means a long term solution but we need something from the govt. it impacts the day to day operations of everyone.
47Here's a link I posted on another thread. I think it's a great article to read just to understand the non-bailout thinking.
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/09/29/miron.bailout/index.html?eref=rss...
48the whole $3,000 per person thing is wildly underestimated because it includes everyone in the country - even kids. if you take only taxpayers... you're looking at a lot more money each of us will be "spending" to fix this. i cant believe the bush administration even suggested this. he could have just asked one oil company to hand over their "windfall profits" and this would have been solved by now!
49LilRuck, good article. Thanks for posting the link.
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