It's discouraging, to be sure. But 150 years ago, we had slavery. 100 years ago blacks barely had the right to vote thanks to Jim Crow laws. 50 years ago we ended segregation. And today we have the first black nominee for president. Who knows how far we'll go in the next 50 years?

For the most part, race is fading as an issue but there are always going to be fringe troublemakers waiting to stir things up.

Despicable.

I just can't understand how this is such a big influence still.

wow. just wow.

They have a pretty interesting site.

The mask is for cowardice, right?

You just now realizing that Barry Obama has been playing the "race card" ever since he decided to be Barack Obama instead of Barry Dunham?

For some unknown psychological reason, Barry Dunham Soetoro (Obama) decided when he was in school as Barry Soetoro that he wanted to be President of some Country. And for some reason, unbeknownst to anyone other than himself and possibly his mother, he or they decided that the easiest Country to manipulate for that end would be the United States. Barry Dunham Soetoro (Obama) could not be President of Indonesia or Kenya because his step-father was not a high official in the government of Indonesia and his birth-father had gone out of favor in Kenya due to his drunken behavior among other political events there. And Barry Dunham Soetoro (Obama) wrote his books and manipulated his personal history in order for him not to have to answer the hard questions of his life. Where WAS he born? Is he a Natural Born US Citizen? Is he "black" enough or is he Too Much Arab?

Barry's cousin, Raila Odinga, the Marxist Muslim Kenyan, was given a million dollars by Barry Obama to aid him in his quest for Presidency of Kenya. When he learned that money can't buy the Presidency in Kenya, Odinga's minions threatened riots unless Odinga was given a position of power in the Kenyan government. How that was or will affect Barry Soetoro (Obama) is unknown at present.

I contend that Lolo Soetoro had no reason to lie when he registered Barry Soetoro at both Primary Schools in Jakarta, Indonesia, stating he was a citizen of Indonesia and a Muslim. The only person who has to lie about who he is, turns out to be Barry Dunham Soetoro who masquerades as Barack Hussein Obama, Jr.

wow. too much ignorance.

on and that wasn't directed towards anyone's comment, it was in reference to the contents of this article...

I grew up near what was a KKK hot spot in southern California. My father’s best friend lived in a city that had an active KKK chapter and when he would take me with him on his visits to see his friend I would play with their son who associated with local kids who had family members associated with the KKK. I remember this one kid used to look at me up and down with disgust and one day that little $#!+ shot me in the back from 10 passes with a beebee gun. That mother stung like hell. LMAO, with out a second thought as though I had predicted the situation I immediately walked over to an area of the lawn where the grass grew long near a gutter and found exactly what I suspected, snails. I picked up a hand full walked over to little abner who was raising the gun like he was going to hit me up side me head knocked him on his @$$ and introduced him to escargot. We never had anymore disagreements.

As for the Presidency I believe it will be more of a mild culture shock. If Sen. Obama is elected I do believe that although he will maintain the professionalism that the office requires of him, he will also be bringing a different culture that the Presidency has never seen before. Despite the mass-media I witness Anglo Americans every day who observe Afro-Americans as a different world. Different tastes in music, food, humor and expression; it’s simply a fact and visa versa.

Racism, in my opinion, is just an excuse for childish pride and ignorant tendencies.

I'm so tired of the race debate, I have nothing else to say about it.

Nikki Tinker is a hatemonger and an idiot.

I think racism will probably always be present in our country, that it just changes forms. Now I think it's more covert than in the past, which I think makes it just as if not more damaging. And I don't think it will leave politics ever either.

And Hypnoticmix, my hometown in Indiana is a small town where the next town five minutes down the road has a reputation of being KKK-heavy. My mom, who is a nurse, had to treat an incarcerated Grand Dragon (or whatever Dungeons and Dragons type name they give their leaders, I can't remember) at the clinic that she worked at in that town, and the whole time he squirmed and smooth-talked and basically tried to get my mom to mess up so he could sue the place. I just love how everything they do reflects their high-minded principles (dripping sarcasm). And 10 bb's to the back would really hurt! Do you still have any of them?

"Now I think it's more covert than in the past, which I think makes it just as if not more damaging." Good point.

Racism will be around as long as we have programs which place one race above another, be it segregation, or affirmative action.

i agree with undave. we cant move forward if we continue to dwell in the past. my generation had nothing to do with slavery or Jim crow. so i think any sort of segregation or affirmative action is wrong if we want to move forward and insure our future children live together in peace.

I don't agree that affirmative action places one race above another. Currently in our country, being born white offers more advantages than being black, and affirmative action tries to level that playing field.

Affirmative action makes it possible for people who aren't the most qualified to get jobs, go to college, or get scholarships for college based on their race, instead of the qualifications. How is that not a racist activity?

I don't agree.

Yes, you could look at it one way and say a program might give advantages to women or minroties, but that seems to be ignoring all of the disadvantages that come with being a member of that group on the whole. The way our country operates now, without affirmative action, makes it possible for people who aren't the most qualified to get jobs, go to college, or get scholarships for college based on their race, instead of the qualifications. The way I see it, our country normally favors a certain group, and the aim of affirmative action is to give everyone equal footing, not to give anyone an advantage.

But this is an extremely complex issue, and one where I can definitely see both sides, though at the end of the day I come down in favor of it. We just hashed it out here to the tune of almost 200 comments, but I believe that was while you were on hiatus.

If you go to the last Affirmative Action post, Bellaressa contributed a lot of good research on the issue, that if read, could clear up a lot of misconceptions people have.

The problem is with hiring and the advancement of minorities. Say you have two white guys, both have their own qualifications for a job, but one of the two doesn't have the leadership qualities necessary for a position, so you hire the other, the best for the job. What does the white guy do when he doesn't get the job? He either accepts it or quits. Now say the one who doesn't get it is a minority. He can sue based on racial discrimination. Before the case goes to court, the boss loses his federal contract, and most likely his license. So, to keep his license, he hires/advances the minority so he can avoid a lawsuit. How is this situation fair to the white guy?

BTW I'm basing my comment on bela's "For federal contractors and subcontractors, affirmative action must be taken by covered employers to recruit and advance qualified minorities, women, persons with disabilities, and covered veterans. Affirmative actions include training programs, outreach efforts, and other positive steps. These procedures should be incorporated into the company’s written personnel policies. Employers with written affirmative action programs must implement them, keep them on file and update them annually."

In your example, it sounds like the problem is with the boss. But it's hard to talk about "affirmative action" generally since it can mean so many different things, and especially in hypothetical examples. Has that boss consistently only hired whites? How many people applied? What was the makeup of the applicant pool? What is their program of affirmative action, is it just outreach and recruiting? Preference in hiring? Further, the minority candidate can sue if he thinks he's been discriminated agaisnt, regardless of any affirmative action program in place, because it's illegal to discriminate in hiring with or without it.

Auntie coosa - these comments:

"And for some reason, unbeknownst to anyone other than himself and possibly his mother, he or they decided that the easiest Country to manipulate for that end would be the United States."
and
"And Barry Dunham Soetoro (Obama) wrote his books and manipulated his personal history in order for him not to have to answer the hard questions of his life.Where WAS he born? Is he a Natural Born US Citizen?"

Who are you to say that he is "manipulating" the U.S. or for that matter his personal history? Why do you speak for the rest of us by claiming we are manipulated- I consider most of us here to be fairly intelligent enough to make our own choices. And why do you speak for Obama and his mother- saying they decided such and such? Did you ask them directly? Have Obama and his mother told you this?

You think that his opponents and the administration are such clueless idiots that they would let someone who does not fit the requirements to run for President to actually run?? You DO realize that one has to be a natural born US citizen in order to be able to actually run for President of United States right?
Therefore are you able to provide us all with some evidence or backing as to why you question his birth and qualifications when his own opponents and the government have accepted that he meets the requirements?

I know I shouldnt feed into the fire but that burned me up.

torg - It doesn't matter what his past hiring policies have been. It only takes one. I am speaking from experience with this. One of my dad's friends owns his own minority construcion company (A "minority company" is longo for a construction company that is smaller than a certain size). Although he had hired and promoted many employees who were minorities, the situation came up above, and he went with the white guy that he worked with better. The end result is he lost the government contracts to work in the Indianapolis Union Station, his company went bankrupt, and he had to move to NY city to work there. Incidently, he was found "not guilty", but that didn't matter to the government.

Not that this thread is about what Auntie Coosa brought up, but since she brought up the subject of where our candidates are born, I found this little Snopes bit quite amusing on the fact that McCain may actually be the one that shouldn't be running, since he was born in Panama.

How's them apples?

(The actual status of the story at present: unconfirmed - the law in this specific matter is somewhat ambiguous - the difference between "citizen" and "natural-born citizen" being one of several reasons).

http://www.snopes.com/politics/mccain/citizen.asp

Enjoy. I know I did.

I understand what you mean unDave but Affirmative Action is not white or black – it does not hire unqualified individuals over qualified. Yes, it is not a perfect system – there is always going to be the bad apples that push to get over. If this system put so many minorities at a better situation or jobs then wouldn’t it be an increase of minority owned business that the government and other companies work at. Wouldn’t there be companies that would have an over flow with minorities. I see a lot of companies still today that I interview with and friends of mine interview at and they are the only minority--- not saying there was not some that was overqualified but some people hire what they are comfortable hiring and not always who is more qualified.

Furthermore, there is not an onslaughter of underqualified people being hired if they are I think that job or position would be high turnover due to the applicant not pulling their own weight and I am sure other workers would complain if there was any worker not pulling their weight and they had to pick up the slack.

Undave, I am sure what the whole situation was but I’m sorry, I doubt it was just a race against another – to actually have a lawsuit and go through the whole EEOC and Affirmative Action laws and make a complaint---you are put through the ringer. You have to not only file a complaint but your complaint is followed up on and EEOC and AA then makes the call to see if you have a case before anything is even processed. A lawyer who doesn’t have the support of the EEOC or AA findings most liking will have a failed case. Did your dad friend in term sue the complaint for his loss of wages and company. He could have done that or maybe he just want to move on.

In the eyes of the government a minority owned business is a business that is at least 51 percent owned by one or more minority individuals or in the case of a publicly-owned business, at least 51 percent of the stock of which is owned by one or more individuals whose management and daily business operations are controlled by one or more minority individuals.
http://www.querycat.com/faq/664b21fdb9f772870422fddbd22457e8.

Who qualifies to be a Disadvantaged Business Enterprise?
Socially and economically disadvantaged individuals are those who are (in addition to being economically disadvantaged) citizens (or lawfully admitted permanent residents) of the United States who are: individuals in the following groups, of which are rebuttably presumed to be socially and economically disadvantaged: Hispanic Americans, which includes persons of Mexican, Puerto Rican, Cuban, Dominican, Central or South American, or other Spanish or Portuguese culture or origin, regardless of race.

Who qualifies as a minority?

Black / African Americans, Native Americans, Hispanic / Latino Americans (including Portuguese), and Asian / Pacific Americans. The latter group includes those with ancestry in China, Japan, Korea, Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos, the Philippines, Malaysia, Indonesia, the Pacific islands, Thailand, Burma, Bangladesh, India, Sri Lanka, and Pakistan. Proof of minority status is required.

Who qualifies for certification as a Small Business Enterprise?
Businesses that meet the following 3 criteria qualify to apply for Small Business Enterprise Certification: ldquo; Small Business Enterprise” or “SBE” is a business that has an occupational license, is located in, and doing business in Broward County. Each business must be an independently owned and operated business which employs twenty-five (25) or fewer permanent full time employees.

Furthermore, The National Association of Minority Government Contractors (NAMGC) is an organization dedicated to enhancing diversification of the workplace. NAMGC provides opportunities for the Federal, State and Local Government sector to find key resources in order to engage in contracting opportunities. NAMGC serves as an outreach mechanism to reach individuals with diverse backgrounds, ample experience and exceptional skills.

NAMGC membership is rewarding to all individuals who want to benefit from a strong supportive system of sharing information and services with individuals and groups having common interests; one which connects people with opportunities. We offer training, services and networking opportunities to foster the relationships that impact government contracting on all levels.

http://www.namgc.org/

Also check out: http://www.ohioworkforce.org/docs/jobseekers/Government%20Contractors-Af...

affirmative action doesn't just help blacks, but everyone is isn't a white male, which is a vast majority of american people, FYI.

Rabid - I also have heard questions brought up about Obama's birth record. It appears to be a forgery. Either way, both were born of American parents, and that makes them American.

some of the comments on this post are really unfortunate, and they are further proof that we will never move forward in the race debate if some people clench on to old prejudices.

I think that Obama's candidacy might inspire the hate in some, but it also inspires the good in others. For every dark behavior that is nurtured by this, I think there are also a lot of people who are learning to stand up and become active in their communities and speak out against all types of injustice.

white revolution? hahahha. these people are crazy.

Affirmative action was discussed in length on a thread from a couple of days ago and is kinda off topic for this thread.

Why would Tinker run an ad showing her Jewish opponent side by side with a member of the KKK? Would anybody respond to that positively? What genius thought that up?

I wonder if the white surpremist plan on voting for Obama in hopes for a backlash.

Not to nitpick, but the picture accompanying this article has nothing to do with the KKK. That looks like a Catholic religious procession, the likes of which are common in Spain or Italy.

The uniforms do look similar, but trust me, they have nothing to do with the KKK.

WHERE DID THE KKK PHOTO COME FROM?