WTF?!? This is just stupid.

Haha When I took the poll there was one vote vote for the first answer and one for the second, I guess that's me and you.

I feel the same way I do about providing condoms to teenagers: it's going to happen no matter what, may as well make it safer.

Yeah, it's us, and we disagree on this. Who are they having sex with? Other guys? Are we sure those other guys are willing participants?

I'm pretty sure we know that a lot of time it is not consensual. I hp[e I will live my life without ever being raped in prison, but if I am I would prefer to walk away from it without a disease.

So why are we condoning nonconsensual sex? Shouldn't we be doing more to prevent it, rather than pass out comdoms?
"I just raped you, but you should be happy that I used a condom. Don't tell anyone, or the nest time I won't."

Whoa, not sure how I missed that nasty typo. Should say hope, of course.

But anyways, it's not condoning it. Do you think keeping condoms out of prisons will reduce the rate of sex or sexual abuse?

No, but using the money that they are spending on condems to hire more security guards would.

Ha!! 2 to 1. More people agree with me than you Torg.

JK

Yes, it is condoning it. That's pretty much the definition of condone. I've always thought that there isn't nearly enough effort put into preventing prison violence. Now we're spending money to protect those who break the law by having sex in prison? Put the money to better use.

Anyway, I think its unrealistic to expect rapists to use a condom. Especially those already infected with an STD. This is not likely to solve any problems.

I think that this is a matter of gay rights. Surely the prisoners would be allowed to use protection when having conjugal visits, but prisoners are not allowed to have conjugal visits with their homosexual partners who are also incarcerated. It is only natural for romances to bloom in such a lonely environment, and to deny that these romances will occur is just absurd. It is better to put a bandaid/condom over the problem than to just ignore it altogether.

"No, but using the money that they are spending on condems to hire more security guards would."

Putting in the machines and providing the condoms costs $60,000. The condoms will continue to be an expense, though the machines will not. $60,000, even if that were an annual cost, would not be enough money to beef up security. Furthermore, a non-profit organization is offering to provide the condoms and machines, not taxpayer money. So basically, using the money to hire more security is not an option.

There is lots of sex going on in prison, and it is already "illegal". It still hasn't stopped it. I think that the machines are a good thing, especially since the condoms are donated. The less diseases spread, the better off society is.

It is stupid because it condones jail-rape and sodomy. Jail is not the place for sexual liaisons.

Why not just go back to flogging for certain crimes? Cheaper than putting condom machines in every jail.

Prison sex is nothing new. I'm not appalled by it whether it's consensual or not. Im glad theyre finally doing something that might just be helpful.

I think it's a good idea, but for the most part, I don't see inmates using them.

If a healthy person can go to prison for involuntary homicide because someone died in a car accident for which they were cited - and comes out of prison with AIDS, exactly how is justice served?

The condoms aren't costing taxpayers anything, and prisoners are having sex anyway - with each other and with guards if you check the statistics. It's a really creepy pretense at morality to keep the condoms out.

Hmm..well, I didn't know that prison sex was illegal. I guess though, if it's going to happen those doing it should be able to have safer sex. I mean, no one can really complain if tax payer money isn't providing the money for the condoms anyways.

RockAndRepublic, you're not appalled by rape? That's pretty disgusting. Maybe you meant to say you're not surprised?

Rapists don't use condoms. It's tricky to put one on while you're trying to sodomize another man against his will. Besides those who just don't care, many prison rapists WANT to pass their STDs onto their victims. It's just one more form of control and dominance.

Mich, I was thinking the same thing. No rapist is going to use a condom.

Rape is appalling, but it already goes on in prison - the condoms aren't going to stop that. Not all prison sex is rape, not all prison sex is between two prisoners - so if the condoms stop one person from getting AIDS, where's the harm?

I don't think it is really intelligent to put someone in prison for a crime, then once they are there tell them "oh, it's illegal to have sex while in prison, but here, have condoms in case you want to". It is condoning illegal activity and gives the prisioner the message that it is ok to flaut the law.

Also, as was also noted in this article, the condoms could provide a hiding place for contraband such as drugs. Rather than solving the std/aids problem among prisioners, it could just add to other problems, such as increased drug use.

Rape is appalling, but it already goes on in prison

Exactly! It happens.

This has been said many times elsewhere, but I think it still fits.... Saying that these condom machines condone prison sex or rape is like saying fire extinguishers condone arson.

I have never been in prison, but from the universality of jokes about people being raped in prison (I have heard people talk about it in every country I've ever been to) I think it may be a reality of prison life. It would, obviously, be better if prisons could end this abuse, but since this doesn't seem possible in the short term it is better for the victims to at least be protected.

I agree with Jillness and Steph.

Hey, that means you agree with me, too...

oops...yes of course. You too torgleson.

Thanks, thanks. I wanted to sit at the cool table, too!

Well if you're going to sit at the cool table than you're going to need a cocktail!

We were dying of thirst while you were away HF.

Haha, this is totally like high school! I would chide you for peer pressuring me to drink, but I admit I'm headed to brunch and mimosas soon anyways.

Torg's starting her day at a very cool table!

Any table with champagne and gruyere omelets is cool in my book.

Dying of thirst!???!!!! OH NO! Can't have that!

Ummmm....torgleson you just made me drool on my laptop.

Sorry!

Gruyere is my favorite.

Yum!!! I love Gruyere in French Onion soup...instead of mozzarella. mmmmmm so good.

French Onion soup with mozzarella is a travesty. Provolone, maybe. But oh, gruyere! Cannot be beat.

So you guys really think rapists will use condoms?
It's better to spend money on safety in prisons that to give them condoms and keep an eye blind on whatever's happening in there.

condoms or security is not the option we are faced with. $60,000 to provide condoms, that's enough for one more guard for one year. One more guard will not solve the statewide rape problem. And the $60,000 is from a different pool of money, so it couldn't even go towards a new guard anyways.

Torg, you are right, one more guard won't solve any problems in the prision system. And I think we have all agreed that rapists aren't going to be using these condoms. What we are left with is that we all would hope that those having consentual sex in prision would use these to help stop the spread of AIDS and other STDs.

I am not on the "condom in prison" bandwagon because I think it condones and illegal activity (sex in prison) and gives the wrong message to prisioners (it is ok to disregard the law) and that these condoms could be used to hide contraband (such as drugs) that, in the end, could make these prisons even more dangerous and could potentially increase other problems, such as drug use/addictions.

But to me, the chance of saving one person from contracting aids is worth it - they smuggle drugs and contraband in so many other ways this wouldn't be opening a new door. And when I looked this up yesterday, one article said that prisoners often try to fashion their own condoms out of plastic baggies or saran wrap, so someone wants to use them.

Stephley and RockAndRepublic, of COURSE rape already goes on. That doesn't make it not "appalling". Rock, you're going to get into some trouble saying things aren't "appalling" when you mean they're not "surprising".

Glad we got that very important point out of the way.

I've got another important point, then.

"But to me, the chance of saving one person from contracting aids is worth it - they smuggle drugs and contraband in so many other ways this wouldn't be opening a new door."

Actually, that's the definition of "opening a new door".

Prisoners should not be having sex. Period. I'm all for spending the necessary funds to make sure this doesn't happen. We should not allow non-profit groups to use their donations to strong arm the prison system into condoning law breaking IN PRISON. It sets a bad precedent and will have unintended consequences in addition to not being terribly effective at fighting STDs.

What I'm confused about is why it's against the law for men to have sex in prison. People involved in relationships are much more stable than those who are single. And homosexuals are less likely to commit prison rape, because of their inherent ability to enjoy consensual sex, without needing the machoismo of dominance. Furthermore, homosexuals are not the aggressors in prison rape. In fact, men who commit prison rape do not consider themselves to be engaging in homosexual behavior at all.

So, why aren't we encouraging men in prison to become homosexual? That way they wouldn't have to rape each other (because they both want to have sex with other guys). Surely they'll find someone to their liking in the entire prison population.

In closing, "We're much too busy being fabulous to commit any crimes, sweetie."-Nelson-ga (re: homosexuals and violent crime)

"But to me, the chance of saving one person from contracting aids is worth it - they smuggle drugs and contraband in so many other ways this wouldn't be opening a new door."

Ok, so let's follow this logic through. So...they already have sex in prison, so let's just give them condoms so that we can possibly prevent the spread of AIDs. So, they are shooting up these contraband drugs in prision - sharing makeshift needles, etc., which also can contribute to the spread of AIDs. Should we install a free vending machine with syringes in it too?

Martini, I was about to use the same analogy! Well said.

@ Mich

The numbers of prisoners who have sex in prison - consenually and not -- are far greater than the numbers of prisoners shooting up in prison. Sex is more easily accessible than drugs, with or without condoms.

The money you're willing to spend on keeping prisoners from having sex would be better spent keeping drugs and drug paraphenalia out - prisoners don't need to smuggle anything in to have sex. Rape in prison situations has been an issue far longer than drugs and most prisoners have a natural and greater desire for sex than for drugs.

Remember, not everyone in prison is a hardened criminal - a lot of people find themselves in prison for white collar crimes, accidents or lapses of judgement. Those people are more likely to be raped or to indulge in sexual activity than they are to decide to start shooting up drugs.

Yum!!! I love Gruyere in French Onion soup...instead of mozzarella. mmmmmm so good.

Let me guess, TGI Friday's? I did enjoy that dish.

Good afternoon everyone! Mind if I join the cool table as the voice of difference.