Ride 'em cowboys! Here's a little poll for you state's rights-ers out there: a new Zogby poll shows that one in five Americans believe that any state or region has the right to "peaceably secede from the United States and become an independent republic." Those in the South and East agreed a little stronger with the notion of ditching the "United" part (perhaps because they've done it before?) and young people agreed with the notion much more strongly — 40 percent of them in fact.
It's one thing to believe in it — but would they support an secession effort by their state? Yup, 18 percent would buy in, with another 10 percent not being sure.
Though the South Carolina secession could be the most famous historical example of breaking away, the Times has a smashing tale of a rogue state fantasy of rebels in 1939 to grab chunks of Wyoming, South Dakota, and Montana to form a new state, Absaroka. The plan was complete with license plates, a Miss Absaroka 1939, and a visit from a foreign King (of Norway.)
If this tale, combined with the fact that 22 percent believe a state can secede — should the US be fearing for the union? Would you support an effort to secede?
Bi La Li
Julia Cocco'
Ash
If the document that cements the union the Constitution, is not being followed, then the states have the right to secede.
1Sure, why not? They do have the right to do that. I think I'm in a more comfortable seat though living in the 8th or 9th largest economy in the world in California.
2There's not a documented right to secede, but a state could if it really was determined to. There are times when I feel the U.S. and its population are too large and unwieldy to hold together, but I usually feel like we should kick out the states I don't like, not let them quit.
3Huh. This is something I have seriously never given any thought to. I suppose if the citizens of the state overwhelmingly wanted to secede, they should be allowed to do so? But I await more informed insight from the rest of you
4I would love for the a Republican state to secede and then steal the Constitution and actually follow the document. It is not like the US is using it anymore anyway.
5I definitely think states have the right to break off if they'd] like to.
6Hmmmm. Does anyone remember "A nation divided against itself can not stand."?
7"I would love for the a Republican state to secede and then steal the Constitution and actually follow the document. It is not like the US is using it anymore anyway."
I actually think about this on a fairly regular basis...is that strange?
8Could we just take the midwest and leave the coasts to the libs?
9You don't want the Southeast coast Dave? I'd like to take the Savannah/Charleston area!
10We could take the southeast as well, and we might as well grab the gulf coast then. Heck, let's take everything but NY and SF. The libs can huddle together in those two extremes...
11Yeah, we must have Louisiana (I just can't have N.O. in another country), and we all know that Montana would want to take part. I agree, everything but SF and NY. Well, let's let them have Jersey.
12Do we give them the entire New England area then? I don't mind being generous there...
13Heck, why not? I do love Boston, but I'll be charitable (just call me a compassionate conservative) and hand that over. The Northeast is just too crowded and expensive anyways.
14Then it's settled. Think we can get Cine or SY to draw us up a new map?
15you'll have a map by the morning dave.
I'm loving this plan guys. And tiff you are so compassionate!
16
17Thanks for the extra work Sy. I look forward to seeing it.
If you guys start a Red State, you'll need to elect someone other than Bush-Cheney if you're going to follow the Constitution - they hate it.
18what state could actually unite in that way? Even a predominately liberal or republican "state" has factions that are against the majority.
19duh steph, cine and I will run it.
20That'll be a good start Sy. Which states would you take and what would you do for money?
21I'd pretty much assume we'd take the Confederate States and, as such, would be pretty self supporting.
22All right!
Those are the states we get and we still have taxes, but very little federal government and the states are still autonomous and actually get to do the things they're supposed to do under the 10th amendment.
23oh no, 3m. we're taking a lot more than that!!
24Would we be a Confederacy? I really like the concept of a Confederacy over a Union.
25sure 3m!
a confederacy it is!
26That's a GREAT map Sy. That made my day!
What is the difference between a Union and a Confederacy?
27A Confederation is more loosely tied together with more power staying with the states. If the federal level government is looking to do anything, they tend to need a special majority (or even unanimity ) as opposed to a simple majority.
While this is a wide range in the powers of a Confederation, (some more controlling than others) they seem to let more power stay with the individual state instead of the central government.
This is where my preference is as I believe each state is better to run itself than a federal government. I believe the Fed is generally there to help the states to protect itself, not regulate it.
28Self-supporting?
29Sy, that's a bit more than the original confederacy you've got there - leaving lots of room for jealousies and competition that's going to be tricky to handle. You've taken a lot of the Mexican border states, so good luck with that.
thanks 3m. I would have to say I agree. The Fed is too removed from the locals to know what they need. Too easily corrupted.
30LOVE the map!!! Thanks Sy!
I agree, we would absolutely be self-supporting. I am not too worried about the Mexican border states- how could we not include Texas???
Oh, and the idea of being a Confederacy is perfect!
31I just want to know if we wold actually protect our borders, like our current politicians say they want to do?
32i'm with cine_lover!
33I'll go to England and start the betting on how quickly you discover all you've done is re-create Europe.
34europe without socialism thank you very much.
35Sy, I'd love to move there. We can refer to the coasts as "The Freaky Fringes"!
Now we're dissing the entire continent of Europe?
36And what's so wrong with re-creating Europe?
37Dave: I would hope the new Heartland States would protect the borders from those FringeFolks!
Of course, after they bankrupt their economies by driving out business with high taxes and regulations, and skyrocketing entitlement programs, we'll have to figure out whether we should institute some kind of foreign aid.
I vote "No!"
38
laine!
39Steph don't be hating!
40Well, we won't have to worry about an invasion, we'll have our Bibles and guns.
41Who's dissing Europe? And why diss "The Freaky Fringes" but not Europe?
42There's no hate here, I'm fascinated by your experiment - I just think in the end, it's very likely you would create something that looked more like the EU than the U.S.A.
43Instead of foreign aid for the fringes, I vote for a bigger wall.
44Who's dissing the "The Freaky Fringes?" You stated that you would like to get rid of all of the states you don't like, Laine and sy are doing the same.
45Well, if you're betting that we'll recreate Europe, it sounds like you think that's a bad thing.
The "Freaky" label is based on the social, political, and economic policies to which I referred in my comment 38.
Besides, I like the alliteration. I guess I've heard to many clips of Obama's Berlin speech in the last 24 hours.
46Steph, I see what you are saying and in some aspects you are very correct. The major difference being that many of the "states" that comprise the EU are socialistic in nature and thus the end result would just leave a similar external shell without the tasty conservative center.
47Oh and if we were trying to re-create our current federal government then we would have no reason for seceding.....
48OOOOOOOOOO!!!!!! Can we keep all SF people out of our country!!!?!??!?!?!? A want a GIANT wall with people with guns that shoot anyone from San Francisco coming into our country.
And Steph, we would be very self sustaining once we brought production and capitalism back to America. Mix that with some off shore drilling, and we are gold baby. Pure gold!
49"Oh and if we were trying to re-create our current federal government then we would have no reason for seceding....."
How true.
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