Though I don't know of many prisons guarded by the likes of the two pictured below, with the changes happening to crime and punishment in the US, it might not be long. With one out of every 100 Americans behind bars, and prisons turning criminals out to meet their budgets, the debate between what's a human right, and what liberties need be taken away as punishment is a tricky one. Several states have just come to some conclusions — on the side of rights.
In New York's juvenile detention centers, transgender youth are now allowed to wear whatever gendered-uniform they associate with and be called by whatever name they request, as well as receive access to special housing under a new anti-discrimination policy. The enhanced rights are drawing praise from advocacy groups. A spokesman for Governor Paterson said the policy reflects the state's intent to be "tolerant, responsive and respectful" of gender identity and gender expression issues.
Hawaii and California join New York among the small list of states that have taken steps to afford specific civil rights protection to gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender youth in juvenile detention. This comes after a 2001 report found that gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender youth routinely experienced discrimination, harassment and violence in New York's juvenile justice system.
Got Milk? To find out what happens if you're a vegan behind bars, read more.
In Massachusetts a federal judge found that the state prison system violated one prisoner's civil rights by denying him a vegan diet. Though the prison system had offered the man a standard vegetarian diet, he has spent nearly a decade seeking a ruling to receive a vegan diet that excludes all animal products, including eggs and milk products.
His reasoning to require the diet? He's a Buddhist (now) and had a religion specialist testify "explain[ing] why it was wrong to consume food derived from animals and explain[ing] the concept of karma and suffering." Why is the man in prison? He beat his 5-week-old son to death by throwing him onto a hardwood floor, repeatedly stomping on and kicking him, before turning his violence on the his child's mother. He may need more than soy milk to atone for that karmic digression.
Rights are returning after prison in Florida, where Governor Crist announced this week that more than 115,000 felons are to regain their voting rights. The expansion of prison rights might come as a comfort to two California high school students who are facing 69 felony counts for hacking into their school's computer system to change their grades. One of the hackers could face 38 years behind bars. An extra-credit report or two might have been a better solution?
What responsibility do prisons have to cater to human rights? Where do rights stop and punishment begin?
Faith
Gianvito Rossi
Sportmax
I thought prisoners lost all their rights once they were behind bars...
1Political correctness at its finest. I really hate hearing stories about prisoners rights and discrimination and diet woes Boo Hoo MF'ers.
I miss the good old days when prison was punishment and they didnt have any choices.
2I think that this system is very progressive, especially seems these are juvenile systems. Obviously, rehabilitation and deterrence is the ultimate goal, but I think the need to accomodate kids who will find themselves easy targets in an institution as such, is absolutely necessary.
As far as the special vegan diet goes, this is a prison, not a spa. Can you imagine what would happen if the prisons had to accomodate to everyone's preferences? It is a well known fact that when you are convicted and sent to prison, you are not guaranteed all of the civil rights laid out in the Constitution (right to vote, freedom of speech are usually stripped at the prison doors). Even if this individual were not behind prison bars, I doubt the court system would see this diet as being "suspect class" and in need of accomodation.
3I can understand the special provisions for the juveniles that are transgendered, gay, lesbian, etc that would cause them to be a target in such an institution. If their punishment does not involve being beat and etc because of that status then they should make provisions to make sure their punishments are carried out in full without adverse effects especially in the case of juveniles.
As for the food thing, I think they should just get the vital nourishment for their survival. If they don't want it, then it's their choice not to eat it. But they gave up their right to go to a MickyDee's when they robbed it (or whatever else they've managed to do).
4I think even with vegan meals, prison is probably still a pretty bad place to be.
5I agree caterpillar girl! This angers me
6Give me a break, now you get special order meals?
that just makes me mad. If you want to
eat Vegan, no viciously beat your baby to death. Then you don't have to worry about what they will serve you in prison. And the cost of prison is high enough, if you start being a short order
cook for all the inmates can you imagine the rise in cost?
I have no problem with the juvenile centers having a separate place for transgenders, mainly because they are teenagers and part of the issues they may have could be from the treatment or fear of treatment of others for being transgender. It is hard enough figuring out who you are as a teen, I don't have a problem with helping out some very scared kids. Now their punishment should be no less then anyone else's, because they still committed a crime.
7On the one hand, it sounds ridiculous to be catering to a vegan diet on spiritual reasons for a man who beat his toddler to death. On the other, do we really want to discourage growth and transformation in individuals who really need it...? I'd rather have a person who is unlikely to commit violent crime come out the other end than have the satisfaction of punishing someone but see further victims in the future.
I was watching Cool Hand Luke a few months ago and was totally surprised at the fact that they got to drink beer and have little freedoms like that which weren't likely to make prison a fun place to be overall but helped people retain a little humanity and self-respect.
I've always thought they really need to have a way to differentiate between the people who are continuing on with violent and criminal behavior and those who are trying to rise above that. What's the point of trying to change in prison if you are still sitting right next to someone who is perfectly happy to screw with you and keep you down?
8I certainly don't see why human rights and punishment can not go hand in hand.
Giving G.L.B.T. prisoners the option of separate housing is derived from a safety issue. The county jail doesn't need to have to clean up dead children because their Neanderthal cell mates bashed in their heads.
As for the vegan diet I really don't see what the problem is. Give the dude some fresh veggies minus the meat entrée. What's the problem? They're saving money on meat.
As for voting rights if you're out of prison and you've got your $#!+ together and are living a law abiding lifestyle than sure give them their voting rights back.
As for those who are worried about the extra cost, not being humane is not the answer to our fiscal woes. If reading that 1 in 100 Americans will at some point in their lives be incarcerated isn’t enough to spurn a reaction by society to address the root causes of such a high prison population than my hope is certainly dimmed for this society. You don't build more prisons to address crime. This society has become so wrapped up in individualism that we've forgotten to take care of the whole. If we do not take care of the whole the whole will begin to crumble and take us with it.
9Jennifer, If I remember correctly in Cool Hand Luke it was a reward, correct? It does not seem like the vegan meal is a reward but more an accommodation, and that is what I am against. I don't feel that we, as a society should accommodate criminals, not only morally, but as my previous post, there are not enough funds to accommodate everyones grievances.
10Its sad how these prisoners terrorized society, yet they seem to be living the high life with luxuries such as premium diets, cable television, and retaining their constitutional rights. Sadly, there are impoverished people in our country that have never committed a crime, yet they aren't living in the lap of luxury like their felonious counterparts.
I say: not fair. Being imprisoned in a luxury suite is not punishment enough for a murderer, or anybody else who has tainted society.
(I was being metaphorical, and not extreme...heads up).
11"This society has become so wrapped up in individualism that we've forgotten to take care of the whole"
I think this statement holds up for the argument against preparing a separate vegan meal. What happens if everyone wants a special meal? You can't make a exception for one inmate and not another. It will cause more problems in my opinion.
12"I certainly don't see why human rights and punishment can not go hand in hand." me too!
I believe in putting people behind bars for the protection of those they have and will continue to harm.
I cannot condone the terrorizing treatment many receive once they are placed behind bars. If we are going to incarcerate people, it does not mean we need to dehumanize them while they're there. I am not saying we need to be NICE, but we cannot become them. And we cannot allow the violence within the population either.
13Cine there is a vegan restaurant two blocks from my house, everything there is raw. Like I said leave the meat off their tray don't give them milk don't cook the veggies don't add butter and serve it up baby. That to me is a two way accommodation. The prisoner gets the meal they can eat and the system saves a few dollars. You make it sound like we have to bend over backwards and spend extra money to leave meat and dairy off the plate.
14If they are a true vegan, and I can't say I know how far they go, then they will not be allowed to prepare the food with the same utensils, pans, serving ware, any of this. The veggies are not to be kept in the same storage as any meat or dairy, not too mention Vegans need extra vitamins in their meals, so their meals NEED to be more then just some raw veggies. If it were just pulling carrots out of the ground and serving it to the guy, then I would just shrug it off, but it is not.
Again, I do not know how vegan he is, or how much they are accommodating him, so these are all assumptions, but if he is claiming he is Buddhist then my assumptions are probably correct. And I still feel that you lose certain rights, and one of them should be choosing your meal.
15Cine - I don't remember. I was pretty distracted by Paul Newman through much of that movie.
I think I need to clarify my point. I have no problem with providing accomodations - even fairly luxurious accomodations - to exemplary prisoners who exhibit very good behavior that is more likely to continue once they get back out. I also have no problem with providing little more than the bare bones for prisoners who continue violent and criminal behavior even while incarcerated. I really think we need to find a way to keep the salvagable separate from the too far gone. And there need to be near term reasons to try for salvation.
16I agree there should be rewards for well behaved prisoners, like the scene in the movie.
Oh and Paul is TASTY as a young man!
17In both of the articles on Citizen about the imprisonment rates, the statistic is cited incorrectly as 1 in 100 Americans. It's 1 in 100 American adults. Obviously it's still a sh*tty statistic it changes the numbers.
Anyway, I think human rights should be preserved, and I'm sure most people would agree. What is more difficult to agree on, imo, is what is a "right"? Do we have a right to a special diet? I don't know that a Vegan diet is a human right.
18Well yes protein and calcium intake needs to be kept up. Most of the major orange juice manufacturers now have a variety that is fortified with protein and calcium. There is no reason why the whole prison population can not be served this variety of orange juice there for killing two birds with one stone. There is also plenty of calcium in beans, nuts, seeds, and oatmeal. I really don't think getting enough protein and calcium is going to be a huge problem.
19yes, but it all goes into a special diet that needs to be regulated, and it should not be a priority for the chef. Sure it is not a huge problem on paper but for the people who have to go out of their way to make special food for one person it very well could be a problem. Also, orange juice that is not from concentrate is very expensive, so I highly doubt they get top of the line orange juice it is all probably frozen from concentrate.
And again, where to the special accommodations end? And who are they for?
20Cat:
"Boo Hoo MF'ers."
21Rac, give me a break. They shouldn't have broken the law. Period. They are getting theirs.
22Now to comment on the matter. Kids should be rehabilitated, so no harm keeping them safe. Once you are of age.....that is another story. I think prison is entirely too soft.
23Jenn:
"I'd rather have a person who is unlikely to commit violent crime come out the other end than have the satisfaction of punishing someone but see further victims in the future."
That's just it. Violent criminals shouldn't come out!
24Some death row inmates have TV's in their individual cells.
25And ladychaos. Amen! There are cases of people who committed crimes just to be LET IN to prison! They got food and shelter which was more than they had.
26And ladychaos. Amen! There are cases of people who committed crimes just to be LET IN to prison! They got food and shelter which was more than they had.
27Charles Manson does Bella. With cable. Manson.
28+ 3 square meals a day. Plus, you can have a line of credit if your family members send you money the jail gives you a account to buy things. I mean this is Club Med for some people.
29Well that's what I'm trying to say I guess. To accommodate a vegan diet is not unreasonable. How far should accommodations go? Well until they become unreasonable by the standards of common sense.
I also think it's safe to say that the number of vegans in our prison population hardly scratch %1 of the population. I mean unless a secret society of hostile Buddhist monks decide to start terrorizing our neighborhoods I don't think it will ever break %1.
30Great Sommelier: Sad but I know people who think jail is a saving grace.
31Me too Bella. It is sad. Think of what prison used to be like. People sure as hell didn't want to end up in one.
32Sure there are not too many pissed of Buddhist monks, but there are going to be other non vegan inmates who are going to want special rights, and if one got the special treatment then why not others?
And Manson has cable tv in his cell? What happened to reading a book? Next he will have a brand new lap top. Prison is a freaking joke now, no wonder why people laugh about going nowadays.
33I just want to make clear that humane treatment has nothing to do with having TV's, radios, bank accounts etc. We seem to be getting lost in shades of grey here. That to me is exceptional treatment; however there is a method to the madness.
As you suggested Great Sommelier prisons are not what they used to be, when you were in you knew you were being punished. I agree. The reason for such fluff treatment all boils down to safety. Prison populations are over flowing and prison staffs are understaffed. The wardens understand that keeping a population content is the best ingredient for safety. If that means allowing a TV, radio etc. than so be it.
Like I said before more prisons and stricter sentencing is not the answer to our problem here. Addressing the root of the problem is our salvation from this headache.
34Has anyone here ever been to prison or juvenile detention or known anyone who's been to prison? It's not a vacation or some hotel. Most prisons are not the Martha Stewart jam making types. Most prisons are brutal hell holes, and the edicts like "3 strikes you're out" are filling up the prisons faster and faster and we're forced to jail petty crime offenders with violent crime offenders. This is not a recipe for rehabilitation.
A lot of these people are in there because they made one bad decision, we shouldn't take away their humanity too! People deserve a second chance. Especially Juveniles. People commit crimes and should be punished but it doesn't mean we get to dehumanize them and throw them to the wolves. The constitution was written for ALL not just the pious. If you've paid your debt to society, then you should be able to vote and have your rights reinstated.
Allowing people to have basic access to information and proper nutrition is a step toward rehabilitation. Perhaps showing some compassion and kindness towards those who are troubled could lead by example. Allowing people to stew in the brutality of prison with no alternative example is a way of breeding more violence.
35Well, ona, I can't find anything on here that says the juvies should get harsher treatment. But as an adult, that is the price you pay for mistakes. That's life.
36Maybe prison would feel more like punishment if we weren't throwing such a large portion of our population into it. Now it seems like a pit stop on the way to hopelessness.
37More and more juveniles are tried as adults and jailed with adults.
And that shouldn't be life, that's not a good enough explanation or a good enough goal. Life used to be brutal for many and women couldn't vote the explanation that that's life wasn't good enough then and shouldn't be good enough now. Accepting such an archaic system without the hope of something better is a disgrace to ourselves. If we call our selves civilized then in the least we should be open to the idea that there is a better means of crime punishment and crime prevention. We/I may not have better alternatives but blind acceptance of a broken system is not sad.
38"is sad"
39I agree onabanana the system needs to be reformed.
40Jail was a saving grace for a guy I know. He spent years on drugs, in between homelessness and prison until one day he meet someone who was kind enough to treat him like a person or worth. He's now a sou-chef at a great restaurant and drug free for 8 years.
41Another reason why rehabilitation would not only strengthen our society but save us money in the long run.
42ona, big difference there. Women fought for their rights. Legally. I don't see a comparison between the two at all.
43Let's see, women's rights as equals vs. Criminals who have broken the law. Oh wait, nope, still can't see an similarities. And this is one of the biggest problems with society today. There aren't consequences for our actions. If you break the law, you pay the price. Period.
And I will be saying that as long as there is breath in my body. Some people are just bad. I have had the unfortunate opportunity to know this.
44Women broke the law, they pranced around protesting, showing their ankles, which in certain states and counties...not OK. I'm pretty sure the powers that be at the time pretty much thought these women were of loose morals or possessed.
At one time it was ok to throw African American's in jail for sorts of violations. (I guess it's the same today except we throw in some Latinos to give ti diversity.)(And NO I am not calling you raciest! jab at the system not you) Point being, THIS SYSTEM WAS BROKEN AND IS BROKEN. We should not resign to the idea that it's just fine. I don't know the answer, but I don't believe in a country like ours, if we really believe the stuff be spout out about be great and all that, that we can't somehow think of a better idea.
45you break the law once...you pay for it once.....not difficult to understand. IF the prisons are overcrowded you dont make life easier for them by pandering to thier nitpicky needs, you want them to be miserable.
46And I'm not saying that people who break the law should go to jail or be punished. But we shouldn't treat people worse than animals, have them hangout with those even worse then they are and then let them back into society and then wonder why people commit more crimes.
47"shouldn't"
48CaterpillarGirl in so making them miserable you put the safety of the prison staff which as I stated above are understaffed in harms way. Going out of our way to make prison comfy is not my idea either but it is a situation dictated by circumstances.
49"you break the law once...you pay for it once.....not difficult"
When you take away a person's right to vote, when they have no access to education, when they get beaten to near death or are raped because of their sexual orientation, they pay much more than once.
We don't simply throw people in jail because they commit crimes we throw them in jail in hopes of making our community a safer place. We should ask if our means are accomplishing our goals.
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