al jazeera "recounted his story" his lawyers "claim" Until i know the REAL facts about him, i have no opinion.

I'd like to know his story as well, from a source other than his employer. Do you have that information?

A link in the story goes to another international news service — France 24. It's like a French version of CNN. I'll find you guys some more info.

I read that one but it doesn't has much.

have

OK here is the story from the Associated Press. The details are just as Al Jazeera recounted. There are some more details, too.

Thanks Lib.

i wish i was surprised by this.

I can't believe that some of you actually still defend this administration's actions. Does it matter that he may have been connected to terrorists? In this country of laws you do not hold people for six years without a trial. We do not do that. No matter how afraid we are or become. That is what makes our nation great. What is wrong with you?

who is defending? All I asked for was a story that isnt from his lawyer or boss.

Does it matter? My God, the man was held captive for SIX YEARS in prison without a trial! What's the other side to that story?

same here rac. Don't get your panties in a knot.

so you're saying we should just believe every thing we read and never look for other sources???

No, I'm saying that holding people for six years and torturing them without a trial is wrong. It doesn't matter what sources there are. It's funny, but I thought conservatives would be morally outraged by this sort of abuse on by the federal government. Or is that just reserved for when the federal government wants to help poor people?

I knew the first comments would question the validity of the story because of al-Jazeera.
By the time some people are convinced that the Administration is allowing/causing bad things to happen, most of the world's going to hate us and we'll all be up on charges.

Raciccarone: people need further clarification because this is the very first time in the history of Guantanamo that someone has been held without trial, beaten, and forced to suffer the mental anguish of never knowing when he'll be able to return to his home and family. It's just hard to imagine anything bad happening at a place like Guantanamo, where no one has ever been mistreated or subjected to something like this.

Yesteryear, I totally disagree with you! Guantanamo is a festering boil on the face of finely upholstered luggage! Do you have such luggage. Unclaimed perhaps? Rolling on the luggage round and round thing at the airport? Do you? DO YOU?

I'm sorry you disagree rac, but I would much rather read an article by the New Yorker or someone else who has really dug up the information, found out all sides of the story, talked to insiders, got documents, etc. etc. from an unbiased stand point (not because I hate al jazeera but because it was his EMPLOYER!)

It IS hard to believe, and I do want to find out more before I spout off things in the comments section.

I do. And I hope they don't run it through a scanner... because I've got a bomb.

and since when is questioning for another source equal to condoning actions.

Yesteryear! I totally disagree with your last comment. Your lethargic insensitivity causes me gastrointestinal pain. Why can't you offer me Maalox?

syako: though raciccarone is clearly a rabid raccoon, i believe the point he/she is trying to make is that with all of the other news that has come out about guantanamo, and with all of the other people who have gone through things exactly like this, asking for further proof just makes you sound like it's not believable, when it's actually not only believable, it's predictable at this point. it's akin to hearing that michael jackson bedded down with another 9 year old and asking to see the police report.

I'd like to read more about this before I comment because on the face, it sounds absolutely horrendous. But, I have no problem admitting that I find Al Jazeera a rather dubious news source. And I certainly hope the commenters who are outraged (!) that anyone could possibly doubt Al Jazeera think Fox News is a completely credible news source and implicitly trust every word they put out.

But I just don't think that it is logical to assume something. Assumption is a common source of error. And to be perfectly honest I would want to see the police report. Call my crazy but I like to know the facts before forming an opinion. Plus I also like to look at things on a case-by-case basis. So while things like this happen often, I don't like to assume that it is always the truth just because someone's lawyer said it was so. I'm totally not condoning either Guantanamo or the treatment of prisoners there, I was just asking for more sources, data, evidence, research. I don't know how that makes me a monster?

It's not so much that you asked for a second source, it is that you so reliably ask for second sources on stories like this.
If you search Guantanamo at the New Yorker site, you get three pages of articles, and when you take out movie reviews and the like, you've got 17 stories that at least reference torture.

I do read those articles. In fact I have the most current issue with a G.B. article sitting at my desk waiting to be read. But it's not about this dude.

geez people why the it's frickin Friday.

I think some of us get real testy over torture and other human rights abuses in the name of democracy.

rightfully so.

but don't take it out on me

hey i'll meet you guys all over at the story just posted asking us if we like GWB. i can't wait to carry on this argument there! yahoo!

You know I went to elementary school with a Sami from Sudan I think I'm going to do some follow up on this story.

As I said in another post the Pentagon must allow justice to enter Guantanamo Bay, so that others like Sami are not robbed of their humanity for no good reason. This is an outrage and an embarrassment.

This is also one of the things that the U.S. does as a nation that turns out to be very wrong and we as a nation do not offer sincere apology for such acts because some how acknowledging a wrong makes us seem weak. We are more worried about our collective image than we are about our true substance. This is precisely one of the things that foreigners see as American arrogance.

hypnoticmix: you bring up a good point. i wonder what would happen if guantanamo wasn't just in cuba, it was a cuban prison... we would be up in arms about the communists holding people without just cause and we'd be using it as an example of why we are better. more people should be ashamed by stories like this. i know i am.

Syako, sorry if you felt piled on - it happens to everyone at least once.

of course it happens to most. and I apologize if I've ever done it to you! (which I'm sure has happened before ) Anywho, I'm off to lunch now where I'll finally try to get to that New Yorker article...

I think people don't like feeling that they're somehow a part of this type of behavior, which we sort of are if we're Americans. I think we want to believe that we are good, that our country is good, and that our government behaves in a fundamentally moral way. I think that is why people are resistent to believing these atrocities.

It's like, if your own brother raped someone, we might say right away, "well there must be some misunderstanding, I want to see the medical reports."

That's what it feels like to me, anyway.

The only solace is that he was released, even though it's too little, too late.

I like the cartoons best.

"Or is that just reserved for when the federal government wants to help poor people?"

Wow, rac. That was totally uncalled for and a completely ignorant response.

it is a shame that this can happen, but unfortunately it does and and it has and not just this once...

I think Rac was well within reason Cine - we can find plenty of posts with outrageous remarks about lazy immigrants who don't deserve anything but boots to their bums, but this story of torture just inspired skepticism.

really steph? Show me where the regular conservatives on this board have ever said that immigrants are lazy and deserve a boot up their butts. I would love to see where Syako, Cabaker, Betty, lilkimbo or myself have ever written such things.

I have seen plenty of things against Conservatives with the Liberals spewing complete ignorance implying or out right saying that we are money grubbing liars. Or comments against Catholics and Christians.

Of course the one post on this site that showed that we, Conservatives, give more to charity then you Libs, YOU did not believe and said you needed more information to confirm such a report. Just like Sy, who never said she did not believe this story, just said she would like more information before jumping to conclusions.

Funny how so many liberals say how open minded they are, yet they leave the nastiest comments on this site against conservatives and have been the most closed minded in my experience here.

Honestly Cine, both sides are doing it. I've noticed if there are every stories shedding a positive light on the Military or current Government, the conservatives never speak up asking for facts to back this up. You (collective you) question that which you don't necessarily want to agree with.

Furthermore, I've seen people spewing ridiculous "facts" to counter stories such as the one posted (an example, rape in the military) and most of the conservatives (without even looking to see if the counter argument is accurate) readily agree.

My thoughts? I'm glad we're keeping each other in check and balance..both sides and the inbetweens as well. I don't want to get too comfortable thinking that every story about human rights abuses is completely accurate nor do I want others thinking America is perfect or close to it. However, it can get aggravating, that's for sure.

I completely agree with Syako. Asking for more information does not mean you're condoning anything.

I know its very stylish to assume the gov't is out to get us all, but sometimes thats just not the case.

NYF, i agree that we all do it to each other. But what positive light on the military story has there ever been? This site is very anti-government and US military. And we don't ask for facts backing anything up, because the Libs do it for us And when they do, do we freak out on them? I don't think so.

It is not the fact that we ask for back sources, it is how people reacted to Syako when she asked for sources. Like she was a criminal. It was uncalled for.

And when Syako complained, I offered an apology.

That is why I did not direct my comment towards you.

and I accepted that apology steph

Hey everyone. I just want you all to know that I'm not anti-military. I'm just trying to spark some thought and discussion about what our government's actions — and I think such a healthy debate is very American!

Would you guys quit slappin each other. Honestly!

A healthy debate is very American, but articles showing the good side of the military are just as American.

"A healthy debate is very American, but articles showing the good side of the military are just as American."